Is Self-Deception More Common Than We Think?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the concept of self-deception, exploring its prevalence and implications for personal integrity and relationships. Participants reflect on the nature of honesty, the emotional costs associated with truth, and the challenges of self-examination.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant describes self-deception as a frequent, unconscious behavior that arises from a desire to avoid emotional pain, suggesting that a balance between truth and falsehood is necessary for survival.
  • Another participant expresses that while honesty can be painful, it often leads to anger from others, complicating interpersonal dynamics.
  • Several participants argue that self-deception is detrimental, emphasizing the importance of acknowledging problems to solve them, with one referencing a quote about the value of an examined life.
  • Another participant proposes that the greatest lie may be the illusion of honesty itself.
  • A quote from Feynman is shared, highlighting the idea that self-deception is a significant risk.
  • One participant reflects on the difficulty of maintaining honesty with oneself and the value of integrity in personal relationships.
  • There is a discussion about the attribution of a quote regarding the examined life, with some participants questioning its origins and validity.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of views on the nature and impact of self-deception, with some agreeing on its dangers while others focus on the complexities of honesty and emotional pain. No consensus is reached regarding the implications of self-deception or the validity of the quoted sayings.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference various philosophical texts and quotes, but there is uncertainty regarding their exact origins and interpretations. The discussion reflects differing perspectives on the emotional costs of honesty and the nature of self-deception.

Loren Booda
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My girlfriend sometimes kids me that I am a "chameleon." I fool myself often, unconsciously, no doubt hundreds of times a day. Lies to myself arise from reasonable convenience and avoiding emotional pain, although I consider myself a very honest person. Life seems an alternation within a duality of truth and falsehood - I consider both. Being absolutely truthful would lead to an early death, I fear. At the end of the day, at least I have endeavored for truth toward others.

Do you find that prevarication is actually so prevalent, or that verity is worth the pain?
 
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Worth the pain to some degree, but it just makes people angry unfortunately. Sometimes I think advice or suggestions just aren't worth giving under any circumstances. If you give advice, the person thinks you are snobbish and also doesn't want to be proved wrong, so avoids you thereafter or shuts you down if you attempt to do it in the future. Good intentions don't buy you anything.
 
There is no possible way to solve problems you don't acknowledge. I think lying to yourself is even worse than lying to others.

I think there's even a line in the bhagavad gita or some such that runs, "The unexamined life is not worth living."
 
Perhaps the greatest lie involves basking in the reflection of "honesty."
 
To quote Feynmen:

"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool."
 
twisting_edge said:
There is no possible way to solve problems you don't acknowledge. I think lying to yourself is even worse than lying to others.

I think there's even a line in the bhagavad gita or some such that runs, "The unexamined life is not worth living."

Agree 100%!

I've heard of the quote to, but also forgot where it came from.

I make really good friends with those who openly examine their lives without feeling insulted and offended. I've only met a handful of people with this attitude unfortunately, but at the same time I'm grateful to have found them, or myself really. :biggrin:
 
twisting_edge said:
I think there's even a line in the bhagavad gita or some such that runs, "The unexamined life is not worth living."
Plato attributes the saying to Socrates in "The Apology". In my opinion, Socrates did not say it, but rather Plato did. Here is a copy of the Bhagavad Gita. I could not find the quote there, but perhaps I missed it.

http://www.san.beck.org/Gita.html
 
The capacity to delude ourselves and the lengths to which we will do so is, in my opinion, one of the most dangerous attributes of mankind. It can be difficult and even painful to stay honest with ourselves, but in the end, all we have is our integrity.
 

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