Philosophical theory of determinism

In summary, the conversation discusses the philosophical theory of determinism and whether probability exists or is simply a way to predict when variables cannot be determined. The Aspect experiment and the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle are mentioned as factors that make it difficult to perfectly replicate experiments and determine whether determinism is true. The conversation ends with the idea that if locality is true, it may be possible to duplicate prior conditions, but the HUP limits our ability to do so with precision.
  • #1
Dooga Blackrazor
258
0
My knowledge of physics is plebian so please bare with me. I have been thinking about the philosophical theory of determinism lately, and I am trying to discover the scientific thoughts behind the matter.

In fact, I found that Einstein was worried by Quantum Physics and the presence of seemingly indetermined events. However, to my knowledge, these events are not proven to be indetermined - or are not necessarily irreconcilable within Chaos Theory?

Moving on, however, I have a question I am wondering if someone can answer. Does probability exist or is it a way to predict when variables cannot be determined? For instance, if the exact environmental circumstances were the same (angle, texture, weather, everything), and you flipped a coin, would you get the same result every time? I am inclined to say yes, but I am not knowledable in the area.

Thanks
 
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  • #2
How much of the environment were you proposing to duplicate ?

There is a relationship between determinism and locality...
 
  • #3
Tournesol said:
How much of the environment were you proposing to duplicate ?

There is a relationship between determinism and locality...

Theoretically, all of it. Time, place, area.
 
  • #4
Dooga Blackrazor said:
My knowledge of physics is plebian so please bare with me. I have been thinking about the philosophical theory of determinism lately, and I am trying to discover the scientific thoughts behind the matter.

In fact, I found that Einstein was worried by Quantum Physics and the presence of seemingly indetermined events. However, to my knowledge, these events are not proven to be indetermined - or are not necessarily irreconcilable within Chaos Theory?

Moving on, however, I have a question I am wondering if someone can answer. Does probability exist or is it a way to predict when variables cannot be determined? For instance, if the exact environmental circumstances were the same (angle, texture, weather, everything), and you flipped a coin, would you get the same result every time? I am inclined to say yes, but I am not knowledable in the area.

Thanks
The correct answer is that nobody knows for certain - because the experiment (replicating the precise antecedent conditions) is impossible in the real world. This lies at the heart of (a) chaos theory and (b) Hesienberg's Uncertainty Principle.

Both (a) and (b) act to render it impossible to perfectly replicate any real-world experiment (we can of course replicate artificial world experiments that we already know to be deterministic and based on integer values rather than real values, such as those based on Conway's game of Life).

Having said that - I am inclined to agree with you when you say you are inclined to say yes. I believe determinism is true - which means that if one could perfectly replicate the antecedent conditions, then we have no rational reason (under a deterministic account) to suppose that the outcome would be any different.

Best Regards
 
Last edited:
  • #5
Apart from the Aspect experiment...

(And if locality is true, you *can* duplicate the prior conditions)
 
  • #6
Tournesol said:
Apart from the Aspect experiment...

(And if locality is true, you *can* duplicate the prior conditions)
the HUP prevents one from perfectly duplicating prior conditions - our knowledge of those prior conditions is limited in precision - thus any duplication would be no more than an approximation, within the precision allowed by the HUP

Best Regards
 

What is the philosophical theory of determinism?

The philosophical theory of determinism states that all events, including human actions, are ultimately determined by previous causes. This means that the future is already predetermined and free will is just an illusion.

What are the main arguments for determinism?

One main argument for determinism is the principle of causality, which states that every effect must have a cause. This supports the idea that events are determined by previous causes. Another argument is that the laws of nature are deterministic, meaning that they dictate the outcome of events. Some philosophers also argue that our genetics and environment heavily influence our actions, leaving little room for free will.

How does determinism differ from the concept of fate or destiny?

Determinism is often confused with the concept of fate or destiny, but there is a key difference. While determinism suggests that all events are predetermined by previous causes, fate or destiny implies that there is a predetermined plan for each individual's life. Determinism is a broader concept that applies to all events, while fate or destiny is more specific to an individual's life path.

What are some criticisms of determinism?

One major criticism of determinism is that it goes against the common belief in free will, which is the idea that individuals have control over their own actions. Many argue that determinism undermines moral responsibility and the concept of personal agency. Additionally, some philosophers argue that quantum mechanics and the concept of randomness in nature disprove determinism.

Is there any scientific evidence for determinism?

There is no scientific evidence that definitively proves or disproves determinism. Some studies have shown that our decisions and actions can be heavily influenced by factors such as genetics and environment, supporting the determinist viewpoint. However, there are also studies that suggest the existence of randomness and indeterminacy in nature, which would challenge determinism. Ultimately, the philosophical theory of determinism remains a highly debated and complex topic.

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