Quantum mechanics theory is the most fundamental theory of nature

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the relationship between quantum mechanics and consciousness, exploring whether quantum mechanics can fundamentally explain consciousness and its implications for understanding nature at the smallest scales. Participants engage with theoretical perspectives, potential models, and implications for various fields, including neuroscience and technology.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that if quantum mechanics is the most fundamental theory, it should also explain consciousness, suggesting a deeper level of physics may be necessary.
  • Others question the assumption that consciousness must arise from the smallest scales, raising the fundamental question of what consciousness actually is.
  • A participant mentions Roger Penrose and Stuart Hameroff as proponents of the idea that consciousness may be explained through quantum physics, referencing Penrose's works and their controversial nature.
  • One participant argues that while quantum mechanics could theoretically explain consciousness, it may not be necessary or practical, drawing an analogy to modeling a basketball's trajectory with quantum mechanics instead of classical physics.
  • There are suggestions that quantum mechanics could serve as a tool for modeling consciousness, particularly in the context of quantum computing and its potential impact on scientific and technological advancements.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of views on the relationship between quantum mechanics and consciousness, with no consensus reached. Some support the idea that quantum mechanics could explain consciousness, while others challenge this notion and question its necessity.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the complexity and unintuitive nature of explaining consciousness through quantum mechanics, indicating that the discussion is limited by unresolved definitions and assumptions about consciousness itself.

zahero_2007
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If Quantum mechanics theory is the most fundamental theory of nature that explain it at the smallest scale then it should explain Consciousness . I think that there may be deeper level of physics that can explain it . If consciousness is merely a quantum effect , it may be not only limited to the brain of human and animals but to everything in nature as well
 
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zahero_2007 said:
If Quantum mechanics theory is the most fundamental theory of nature that explain it at the smallest scale then it should explain Consciousness . I think that there may be deeper level of physics that can explain it . If consciousness is merely a quantum effect , it may be not only limited to the brain of human and animals but to everything in nature as well

That would explain the ending of that one movie where the plants were responsible for killing everyone...i never saw it, so i can't remember the name.

Edit: Hey, this just happened to be my 100th post! Woohoo!
 


zahero_2007 said:
If Quantum mechanics theory is the most fundamental theory of nature that explain it at the smallest scale then it should explain Consciousness . I think that there may be deeper level of physics that can explain it . If consciousness is merely a quantum effect , it may be not only limited to the brain of human and animals but to everything in nature as well

Other than the obvious question: what IS consciousness?... why do you believe that this has to arise out of the smallest possible distance scales?
 
This is certainly one of the schools of thought in modern consciousness studies. Controversial, but then what isn't... Roger Penrose and Stuart Hameroff are famous proponents of the idea that consciousness may be explained in terms of fundamental physics: quantum physics as currently known and/or the physics of the future.

Penrose's book The Emperor's New Mind is well worth a read for its ambitious attempt to summerise the most important mathematical and physical concepts of our times; in that it's a precursor to his even more ambitious, The Road to Reality. He also has some intriguing things to say about consciousness and time, and his own thinking experience. I found the final section which tries to relate the mind/body problem to quantum mechanics rather sketchy, but I haven't studied quantum mechanics, so I'm not in a position to judge the merits of the idea. My impression though was that he was invoking one mystery as a possible solution to another, leaving us none the wiser about either. A later book, Shadows of the Mind deals with the same theme, but I haven't seen that one.

Hameroff is an anesthetist, and has more to say about how consciousness and quantum mechanics may relate to the brain. Some of his papers are linked to in the Quantum Computation and Anesthesia sections http://consc.net/online. Search google video to hear talks by him on the subject.
 


Well sure, it could be explained by QM. But it would be a very complicated, unintuitive explanation. The question is whether QM is necessary and so far it's not believed to be.

A similar case would be a basketball going through a hoop. It's perfectly valid in principle to model with QM... but not in practice... but ultimately the question is why? Why would you want to pull QM out on something that can be handled much more efficiently by Newtonian physics?
 


Perhaps, if possible, QM would be a proper tool to model consciousness in a suitable way for a (quantum) computer?
 


Boy@n said:
Perhaps, if possible, QM would be a proper tool to model consciousness in a suitable way for a (quantum) computer?

Well, sure; if claims are true, a qubit will do a lot more for you then a bit in terms of computing power and QM revolutionizing computing eventually... and that will probably revolutionize scientific computing (which a lot of science depends on now, including neuroscience and especially cognitive neuroscience) and that will revolutionize engineering and technology and lifestyle, etc...
 

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