# Space, matter and physical models

1. Feb 4, 2012

### bagheraa

As far as I have seen, all physical models begin with space, and then put matter that live in space and modify it somehow. Basically the models works fine and describe reality farily well. But at some point they arrive to problems, as infinite curvatures, that prevents them to be unified.

It could be possible a model that begins with matter, and from the relations of matter then deduce space? Is this a none sense? What would be the matter?

2. Feb 4, 2012

### Matterwave

To describe "relations" of matter, you need to describe the distance between matter, and once you do that you've introduced "space" in some sense. What kind of a scheme were you thinking about?

3. Feb 4, 2012

### bagheraa

I don't have by now a cocrete idea. I think on something where distance is one of the consecuences of the form the matter units relates between them. Maybe distance is only the time it takes to react to a change. In some sense a matter unit would be reading the past history of other matter units. When we have more than two matter units this shifted times could be, in some aspects, understood as a space.

4. Feb 4, 2012

### James_Harford

Your idea seems neither nonsensical nor silly. Don't forget to include time as well as space, or "spacetime", in your eventual solution!

Regarding the primacy of spacetime vs. matter there are (at least) three possibilities: (1) space is the progenitor of matter. I believe Einstein put considerable effort into deriving matter from empty spacetime. (2) matter is the progenitor of spacetime, which your idea, and doubtlessly others as well. (3) something more fundamental than either, from which both are derived.

My bias is door # (3), but the answer, when it surely comes, might be formulatable in all three ways.

5. Feb 5, 2012

### bagheraa

Where can I find information on my bias door (2) and on yours (3)? Do you have links where I can look for others work?

6. Feb 5, 2012