Stuck on what appears to be simple ODE

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    Ode Stuck
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around solving the ordinary differential equation (ODE) (D^4 + 1)y = 0, where D represents the derivative with respect to x. Participants explore various methods for finding the general solution, including the use of complex exponentials and trigonometric functions.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion after obtaining r^2 = ±i from the characteristic equation, seeking guidance on how to proceed with the general solution.
  • Another participant suggests representing the roots in exponential form, indicating that r^2 can be expressed as e^(π/2)i or e^(3π/2)i, and proposes taking the square root accordingly.
  • A different participant provides a factorization of the ODE, suggesting that solutions can be expressed in terms of complex exponentials or combinations of exponentials and trigonometric functions.
  • A participant reiterates their initial confusion about representing the square root of i in the general solution, providing a detailed expression for y that includes complex exponentials.
  • Participants acknowledge the need for initial conditions to determine a specific solution for y.
  • One participant corrects a LaTeX error in their previous post and suggests using Euler's formula to incorporate trigonometric functions into the solution.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on a single method for solving the ODE, as multiple approaches and representations are discussed. There is ongoing uncertainty regarding the best way to express the roots and the general solution.

Contextual Notes

Some participants' contributions depend on specific interpretations of complex numbers and their representations, which may not be universally agreed upon. The discussion includes various assumptions about the form of the solution and the use of initial conditions.

Airsteve0
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I am completely stuck on where to go with the following ODE:

(D^4 + 1)y = 0 where D=d/dx

I know that trying y=e^(rt) is the obvious solution, however, when you solve this you get r^2 = +-i. At this point I am unsure of what to do becuase if I take the square root of "i" I am unsure of how I will represent it in a general solution. Any assistance would be greatly appreciated, thanks!
 
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An equation like r^4+1=0 means that there are 4 solutions. Instead of putting r^2=+/-i, you can look at r^2=e^(pi/2)*i or e^(3pi/2)*i. Taking the square root, you simply get r=+/-e^(pi/4)*i or +/-e^(3pi/4)*i.

The trick is to put it in the phase explicitly, so that you have an answer.
 
(D^4 + 1)=(D^2+sqrt(2)D+1)(D^2-sqrt(2)D+1)
=(D^2+i)(D^2-i)=(D-√ i)(D+√ i)(D-√- i)(D+√- i)
So write a solution in terms of complex exponentials or products of exponentials and trigonometric functions like (e^r x)cos(a x) according to preference.
 
Airsteve0 said:
I am completely stuck on where to go with the following ODE:

(D^4 + 1)y = 0 where D=d/dx

I know that trying y=e^(rt) is the obvious solution, however, when you solve this you get r^2 = +-i. At this point I am unsure of what to do becuase if I take the square root of "i" I am unsure of how I will represent it in a general solution. Any assistance would be greatly appreciated, thanks!

[tex]\frac{{\mbox{d}}^{4}y}{{\mbox{d}}^{4}x}+y=0[/tex]

[tex]y={e}^{rx}[/tex]

[tex]{r}^{4}+1=0[/tex]

[tex]{r}^{2}=\pm i[/tex]

[tex]r=\pm\frac{1\pm i}{\sqrt{2}}[/tex]

[tex]y={C}_{1}\exp \left(\frac{1+i}{\sqrt{2}}\right)+{C}_{2}\exp \left(\frac{1-i}{\sqrt{2}}\right)+{C}_{3}\exp \left(-\frac{1+i}{\sqrt{2}}\right)+{C}_{4}\exp \left(\frac{i-1}{\sqrt{2}}\right)[/tex]

We can solve for the specific solution for y if and only if we know y(0), y'(0), y''(0), y'''(0) and y''''(0)
 
thanks everyone, I greatly appreciate the help!
 
Airsteve0 said:
thanks everyone, I greatly appreciate the help!

Just realized I made a LaTeX error. Should be

[tex]y={C}_{1}\exp \left(\frac{1+i}{\sqrt{2}}x\right)+{C}_{2}\exp \left(\frac{1-i}{\sqrt{2}}x\right)+{C}_{3}\exp \left(-\frac{1+i}{\sqrt{2}}x\right)+{C}_{4}\exp \left(\frac{i-1}{\sqrt{2}}x\right)[/tex]

and you may want to use euler's formula to put in some trigonometric functions there.
 

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