>Time travel is temporarily possible, at low speed :-)

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of time travel, particularly the idea of traveling through time at "low" speeds and the philosophical implications of time and existence. Participants explore various interpretations of time travel, metaphysical considerations of time, and the philosophical statement "I think, therefore I am." The conversation includes both humorous and serious reflections on these topics.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Meta-discussion

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that traveling west at a certain speed could allow one to arrive before a specific time, though this idea is met with skepticism regarding its validity as time travel.
  • Another participant argues that simply moving through time is a constant experience for everyone, challenging the notion of time travel as something extraordinary.
  • Several participants engage in a philosophical debate about the nature of existence, referencing Descartes' famous statement and questioning its implications.
  • One participant humorously reflects on moments where time seems to stop while waiting for responses in a forum context.
  • Another participant challenges the idea that time does not exist, suggesting that proving time's existence is akin to proving one's own existence.
  • There are multiple interpretations of Descartes' statement, with some participants arguing about its logical structure and implications.
  • A participant humorously critiques the use of Descartes' argument, suggesting it is circular and not a valid proof of existence.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of views on the nature of time and existence, with no clear consensus reached. Some engage in light-hearted banter while others delve into serious philosophical inquiry, indicating a mix of agreement on the exploration of ideas but disagreement on their interpretations and implications.

Contextual Notes

The discussion includes various assumptions about time and existence that are not fully explored or resolved. The philosophical arguments presented rely on interpretations of classical logic and metaphysical concepts that may not be universally accepted.

kleinwolf
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>Time travel is temporarily possible, at "low" speed :-)

This is easy : just go west, faster than 40000km/24=1'666km/h...then starting at 0:00 you arrive before the sun at the next parallel and hence before 0:00...but I don't know if it possible to make that sense of humour recharged of fuel for a long time...
 
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That's not time travel...
 
I can travel through time. If I lay down and a darkened room and try to relax entirely, I suddenly find that it is several hours later. How cool is that?
 
I'd be extremely surprised to find there was anyone anywhere who wasn't constantly traveling through time.
 
oh, there has been a few times late at night when I'd already replied to every post and I could have sworn that time stopped while I waited for someone to reply so I could post again.
 
time in fact doesn't exsist but only metaphysically can it be proven that it is a man made object to fool the "observer"
 
MohammadK said:
time in fact doesn't exsist but only metaphysically can it be proven that it is a man made object to fool the "observer"
Ok...Prove it.
 
I would if I had the time
 
Prove it huh?

well to prove that itself time exsists is in such a way to prove a wavefunction properties of time this in its paradoxal form is like proving your exsistence...Can you prove you exsist? The Ultimate question to every answer.
 
  • #10
MohammadK said:
well to prove that itself time exsists is in such a way to prove a wavefunction properties of time this in its paradoxal form is like proving your exsistence...Can you prove you exsist? The Ultimate question to every answer.
I think, therefore I am.
 
  • #11
I think I am; therefore, I am I am.
 
  • #12
I think therefor I am?

You know if you really spend some time and thought about it " I think therefor I am" doesn't really prove your exsistence, exsistence realtive to space and time had other atributes to itself concerning you true state of living to non-living. Did you exsist 200 years ago when you great grandparents would have given birth to your grand parents and they giving birth to YOUR parents and you in a state of a pre-exsisting embryo. Think about it.
 
  • #13
I am... yet i don't think much.
 
  • #14
kleinwolf said:
This is easy : just go west, faster than 40000km/24=1'666km/h...then starting at 0:00 you arrive before the sun at the next parallel and hence before 0:00...but I don't know if it possible to make that sense of humour recharged of fuel for a long time...

This totally ignores the grandfather paradox. If, using your method, I travel back in time and kill my grandfather, there's just no way I'll be able to get back and deposit his money into my account before the bank closes.
 
  • #15
Aether said:
I think, therefore I am.
Fallicious argument. In order to think you first have to exist so that sentence is really saying "I exist, therefore I exist". That's begging the question.You also used it wrong, Descartes used all of it as a premise, not as an argument in it's self. He later changed it to "I am, I exist." to clear up the misunderstanding because people kept thinking he was infering something.Joke time!

Descartes is sitting in a bar, having a drink. The bartender asks him if he would like another. "I think not," he says and vanishes in a puff of logic.
 
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  • #16
Smurf said:
Fallicious argument. In order to think you first have to exist so that sentence is really saying "I exist, therefore I exist". That's begging the question.


You also used it wrong, Descartes used all of it as a premise, not as an argument in it's self. He later changed it to "I am, I exist." to clear up the misunderstanding because people kept thinking he was infering something.
OK, you are correct.

So, after considering everything very thoroughly, I must finally conclude that the proposition, I am, I exist, is necessarily true whenever it is put forward by me or conceived in my mind. -- Descartes
 
  • #17
Smurf said:
Fallicious argument. In order to think you first have to exist so that sentence is really saying "I exist, therefore I exist". That's begging the question.
If you take 'I think, therefore I exist', or 'P | Q', as an argument with 'P' as the premise and 'Q' as the conclusion, it certainly can't be circular because it isn't valid. However, if you add the premise 'P -> Q' (P implies Q), as you did in asserting that in order to think you first have to exist, it becomes an instance of Modus Ponens, '(P -> Q), P | Q', which isn't circular. You are correct, in a way, that '(P -> Q), P | Q' and 'Q | Q' are saying the same thing in that they are both valid arguments and have corresponding tautologies and theorems in classical logic. '(P -> Q), P | Q' becomes '(((P -> Q) & P) -> Q)' and 'Q | Q' becomes '(Q -> Q)'. In the same way, 'P | Q' corresponds to '(P -> Q)', which is what I had always thought he was asserting. But it seems he was just saying that 'Q' is a performative tautology, i.e., that 'I exist' is always true when the thing that 'I' refers to asserts that 'I exist' is true. Makes me wonder what kinds of things can make assertions. I mean, my printer doesn't make an assertion when it prints 'I exist'... or does it? hmmm...

Um, and I might incur the wrath of the stupid joke gods, but that joke seems to rely on the fallacy of denying the antecedent, '(P -> Q), ~P | ~Q'. Or maybe that was the joke. hmmm...
Now, if he had said 'I do not exist'... :smile: Yeah. Good stuff.
 
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