Was the Obama Assassination Plot by Meth Users a Real Threat?

[WarPhalange]

It was bound to happen.

http://cbs4denver.com/investigates/assisination.plot.obama.2.802827.html

This is before he's officially running and way before he's president. What do you think his average day will be like if he's elected? Will he need a Pope Mobile? Do you think it will be pimped out?

 

[TheStatutoryApe]

I hate white supremacists. Though they can be funny at times.

 

[ramsey2879]

I hate white supremacists. Though they can be funny at times.

It not funny when you think of how much these "supremacists" would love to do anything to cause the race war they predict will come about. I agree with C.S. Lewis where he once said "Pride is the greatest sin of all".

 

[WarPhalange]

It's not pride, it's stupidity, which leads to pride. These people live in trailers in the middle of nowhere and burn wooden crosses for fun but think they are somehow superior to anyone? That's just ridiculous.

 

[turbo]

CBS is reporting that the 3 men have confessed to federal authorities that they intended to assassinate Obama. The coverage hints that authorities are trying to decide how to charge the men based at least in part on the likelihood that they could have pulled off the hit. That's obscene. If they went there with that intent, the obvious charge is conspiracy to commit 1st degree murder. There would be ancillary charges, of course, but the "conspiracy to commit" charge is a slam-dunk. Supposed they fired at Obama at the great distances they anticipated and missed and killed somebody else? Would that somehow translate to negligent homicide? These creeps should go up for a LONG time - life would not be too long, IMO.

http://cosmos.bcst.yahoo.com/up/player/popup/?rn=3906861&cl=9455163&ch=4226716&src=news

 

[isly ilwott]

It's not pride, it's stupidity, which leads to pride. These people live in trailers in the middle of nowhere and burn wooden crosses for fun but think they are somehow superior to anyone? That's just ridiculous.

You generalize somewhat here. There's nothing wrong with living in a "trailer"...whether in the middle of nowhere or not.

 

[turbo]

I hope that the Feds grill these guys very thoroughly. It's possible (however unlikely) that they were being set up as fall-guys for a more serious assassination attempt. I'd be pretty surprised if most white-supremacy groups were not well-infiltrated by people wanting to monitor them and/or manipulate them, and it is possible that the three stooges got financing from someone outside their little circle. It is worth following up at a minimum.

 

[Evo]

Have you seen the documentaries on the skinheads? A lot of them have joined the marines and they said that now these people are better trained than the local police and even SWAT teams and they have been found to have better weapons.

 

[turbo]

Have you seen the documentaries on the skinheads? A lot of them have joined the marines and they said that now these people are better trained than the local police and even SWAT teams and they have been found to have better weapons.

It's not hard to find bolt-action rifles that rival or surpass those used by SWAT teams. Actually, if you want to go a step farther, you can buy single-shot rifles that will surpass the accuracy of most bolt-action rifles at the small expense of time for a follow-up shot. I hunt with a Ruger Model 1, and it is deadly. I bought it with iron sights and found a nice low-power scope for it, and ordered mounting rings. The rings were on back-order, so I took my dad out to a sand-pit, put him on the spotting scope, and took a couple of shots at 75 yards. The first shot, he told me I was about 1/2" high and 1/2" to the right of the bull. After my second shot, he told me that I had missed the paper entirely. I hollered BS! and we walked up to the target to see the shortest little "snowman" you might hope to get with open sights at that range. A Ruger Model 1 with a long bull barrel in a flat-shooting chambering would be my ultimate long-distance rifle. The terrain here does not favor that kind of hunting rifle, so I'm sticking with my .45-70 Medium Sporter.

 

[ramsey2879]

It's not pride, it's stupidity, which leads to pride. These people live in trailers in the middle of nowhere and burn wooden crosses for fun but think they are somehow superior to anyone? That's just ridiculous.

No its pride pure and simple that causes man to do the most evil things. You forget that the unibomber hung out in a shack in the middle of the woods where where he made all those mail bombs. And the scientist that wanted recognition for his work at finding an anthax cure that caused so many deaths with his mailing of the spores to his victims. Also, a false sense of pride was a major factor behind many of the senseles mass killings at schools and businesses that occur all too often. Boasting and being disrespectful out of pride is wrong whether or not the pride is misplace. Being stupid doesn't make a man do evil things. Lack of humility is what causes a man to do evil things. How many times have you read of a murder where the accused suspect stated that he did the crime because someone disrespected him. Merely bumping into a conceited and proud person can be cause for that person to take his vengence on you. How many Clinton supporters have said that they will not vote for Obama merely because they feel slighted by him. Hopefully Clinton will change their minds with her speech tonight.

 

[WarPhalange]

You generalize somewhat here. There's nothing wrong with living in a "trailer"...whether in the middle of nowhere or not.

House > trailer

Every time.

And the scientist that wanted recognition for his work at finding an anthax cure that caused so many deaths with his mailing of the spores to his victims.

That story reeks, by the way. I don't buy it, not for a second.

 

[Gokul43201]

House > trailer

Pwned!11

What is this? The crazy meth heads forum?

Please let's try and be more coherent.

 

[ramsey2879]

CBS is reporting that the 3 men have confessed to federal authorities that they intended to assassinate Obama. The coverage hints that authorities are trying to decide how to charge the men based at least in part on the likelihood that they could have pulled off the hit. That's obscene. If they went there with that intent, the obvious charge is conspiracy to commit 1st degree murder. There would be ancillary charges, of course, but the "conspiracy to commit" charge is a slam-dunk. Supposed they fired at Obama at the great distances they anticipated and missed and killed somebody else? Would that somehow translate to negligent homicide? These creeps should go up for a LONG time - life would not be too long, IMO.

http://cosmos.bcst.yahoo.com/up/player/popup/?rn=3906861&cl=9455163&ch=4226716&src=news

I agree, just ask Morris Dees, who has documented many conspiracies plotted by hate groups and won large judgements against several of them for actively inciting their members to do violent hate crimes. Putting together the facts of disquises, (wigs) bullet proof vests and scoped rifles and racist hatred as reported by one source, it is hard to rule out another conspiracy of some sort. Maybe I am overly optimistic, but it actually looks like the authorities by not filing more significant charges are seeking cooperation from these guys to get evidence against leaders of their group or groups that they attended. Any other interpertation would be surreal. Most unreal is the headline of one story that the officials say the drug addicts were merely doing small talk and mentioned the possibility of killing while high and they "posed no threat to Senator Obama".
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26398461/

 

[WarPhalange]

I wonder what kind of trap they fell into.

Cop: "What are you doing here?"
Guy: "Uhh... I just came to see the n***er a talkin' "

http://img518.imageshack.us/img518/5900/245235tk1.jpg

 

[LightbulbSun]

This is not a surprise to me at all. I knew something like this would happen. If Obama is elected, I fear that his presidency may be short-lived because some narrow minded fool can't handle change.

 

[TheStatutoryApe]

It not funny when you think of how much these "supremacists" would love to do anything to cause the race war they predict will come about. I agree with C.S. Lewis where he once said "Pride is the greatest sin of all".

The fall out if it actually happened would not be funny but the way these people think is quite amusing. Its like people that still think that the world is flat or who think that witchs ought to be burned at the stake.

CBS is reporting that the 3 men have confessed to federal authorities that they intended to assassinate Obama. The coverage hints that authorities are trying to decide how to charge the men based at least in part on the likelihood that they could have pulled off the hit. That's obscene. If they went there with that intent, the obvious charge is conspiracy to commit 1st degree murder. There would be ancillary charges, of course, but the "conspiracy to commit" charge is a slam-dunk. Supposed they fired at Obama at the great distances they anticipated and missed and killed somebody else? Would that somehow translate to negligent homicide? These creeps should go up for a LONG time - life would not be too long, IMO.

http://cosmos.bcst.yahoo.com/up/player/popup/?rn=3906861&cl=9455163&ch=4226716&src=news

Perhaps they are thinking it best to only charge them with conspiracy to commit murder instead of conspiracy to assasinate a congressman. If they try to pin them with the assasination conspiracy on some one protected so heavily I'm sure that their lawyer would immediately attack the credibility of the threat and possibly get them off.

Have you seen the documentaries on the skinheads? A lot of them have joined the marines and they said that now these people are better trained than the local police and even SWAT teams and they have been found to have better weapons.

I saw a news story not that long ago on gang members going into the military to get extra training.

I think that skinheads have traditionally had many members with military service though.

 

[ramsey2879]

That story reeks, by the way. I don't buy it, not for a second.

The Anthax case may seem unbelievable but there are many instances where someone has done many similar evil acts all in the guise of making a good name for oneself. C.S Lewis said "Luckily, we have a test, whenever we find that our religious life is making us feel that we are good - above all, that we are better than someone else - I think we may be sure that we are being acted on, not by God, but by the devil."

 

[WarPhalange]

Yes, but it seems these "lone wackos" only happen in the US. Every other place in the world has some weird conspiracies, groups of people trying to carry out attacks. But here we have something super complicated, and we just say "Oh, it was him. By himself." when it doesn't make sense.

For one, he had stolen liquid anthrax and dispersed it in a powdered, ionized form in order to get it to stick to lungs easier. That's not something you do in your basement.

 

[russ_watters]

I wonder what kind of trap they fell into.

It's out now: http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/08/26/obama.threat/index.html?iref=newssearch

There is not enough evidence to conclude that three people arrested with drugs and weapons posed a "true threat" to Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama, the Denver U.S. Attorney said Tuesday.

On Sunday, police in suburban Denver began investigating whether the suspects threatened someone at the Democratic National Convention, a federal law enforcement source told CNN Monday .

On the same day, Aurora, Colorado, police were conducting a routine traffic stop when they saw Tharin Robert Gartrell swerving and driving erratically in a blue Dodge truck with a Colorado license plate. An officer pulled over Gartrell and discovered the 28-year-old was driving on a suspended license and was on probation for possession of methamphetamine, according to an affidavit.

The officer arrested Gartrell and found inside his pants' pocket a small plastic bag containing 4.4 ounces of methamphetamine. A search of the truck turned up two rifles, a bulletproof vest, boxes of ammunition, several guns, hunting scopes, walkie-talkies and drugs, the affidavit states. One of the rifles was stolen, the document states.

Yes, but it seems these "lone wackos" only happen in the US. Every other place in the world has some weird conspiracies, groups of people trying to carry out attacks. But here we have something super complicated, and we just say "Oh, it was him. By himself." when it doesn't make sense.

Didn't we just have that discussion? For whatever reason, you are predisposed to seek conspiracy involving government. Several things wrong with that quote:

-No one said there are no conspiracies. There are and they happen even in the US.
-Lone wackos happen everywhere.
-The anthrax case was not complicated at all.

Heck, this isn't even about looking for/finding conspiracies, it is about mistrust of authority. Many of the major crimes that "conspiracy theories" are made for are, in fact, already conspiracies. Most successful terrorist actions, for example, are not the work of "lone wackos".

Prime example: 9/11 has conspiracy theories surrounding it, but wait - 19 hijackers, plus the the backing of a major terrorist organization? It was a major conspiracy on its own! What do most conspiracy theories have in common though, that the conventional explanation doesn't have? A good fraction of conspiracy theories aren't really about finding conspiracy, they are about finding a way to blame the government/the powerful. That's what this is really about -- again, blanket/blind mistrust of authority.