Well formed formulae in Predicate Calculus

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the properties of well-formed formulae in Predicate Calculus, specifically W1, W2, and W3, and the challenge of proving that any model satisfying all three must contain at least three elements. The scope includes theoretical reasoning and model construction.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Post 1 introduces three well-formed formulae and suggests a model using the relation R interpreted as "less than" on positive integers, questioning the validity of W2.
  • Post 2 reiterates the model using positive integers and emphasizes the need for a three-element model, clarifying that W3 does not imply transitivity of R and suggesting the exploration of one and two-element models.
  • Post 3 requests a suggestion for a one-element model for W1.
  • Post 4 discusses the limited options for a one-element model, indicating that only one configuration can satisfy W1.
  • Post 5 challenges the feasibility of W1 being true in a one-element model, prompting further reflection on the implications of such a model.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the implications of the well-formed formulae, particularly regarding the necessity of a three-element model and the validity of one and two-element models. The discussion remains unresolved as participants explore these concepts.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the exploration of models, particularly regarding the assumptions made about the relation R and the implications of the well-formed formulae. The discussion does not resolve whether one or two-element models can satisfy all conditions.

kp100591
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Consider the following well-formed formulae in the Predicate Calculus:
W1 = (∃x)(∃y) R(x, y)
W2 = (∀x)(∀y) [R(x, y) ⇒ ∼ R(y, x)]
W3 = (∀x)(∀y) [R(x, y) ⇒ (∃z)(R(z, x) ∧ R(y, z))]
Prove that any model in which W1, W2 and W3 are all true must have at least 3 elements. Find one such model with 3 elements.

Proof:
Let U = Z+, and for some x, y ∈ Z+, interpret R(x, y) to mean x < y. Certainly, for some x ∈ Z+, y /<(is not less than) x, so that W1 holds in U.
Furthermore, < is transitive, that is, for all x,y,z ∈ Z+,
x<y<z ⇒ x<z, so that W3 holds in U.
not sure about W2

Please help me with the rest of the working,
and also, suggestions for how to find such a model.

thank you very much.
 
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kp100591 said:
Proof:
Let U = Z+, and for some x, y ∈ Z+, interpret R(x, y) to mean x < y. Certainly, for some x ∈ Z+, y /<(is not less than) x, so that W1 holds in U.
Furthermore, < is transitive, that is, for all x,y,z ∈ Z+,
x<y<z ⇒ x<z, so that W3 holds in U.
Two remarks. First, finding a single infinite model does not help solve this problem. You need to show that every model has at least three elements, and you need a three-element model. Second, W3 does not mean transitivity of R. Its converse (∃z)(R(z, x) ∧ R(y, z)) ⇒ R(x, y) is almost transitivity, but the conclusion has x, y in the wrong order.

I suggest finding a one-element model of W1. Is it a model of W2? Find a two-element model of W1, W2. Are there other two-element models? Is it a model of W3? Let's start here.
 
can you suggest a one-element model for W1 please ?
 
Well, there are not too many candidates there. There is a single element in the universe, and it's either related to itself by R or it's not. Exactly one of these candidates is a model of W1.
 
Ask yourself, if the set on which the relation $R$ is defined has just one element, how can W1 be true?
 

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