What are the methods for solving y''' + y' = tan(t) 0<t<pi?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around methods for solving the differential equation y''' + y' = tan(t) within the interval 0 < t < π. Participants explore various techniques including the Undetermined Coefficient method, Variation of Parameters, and operator methods, while addressing the challenges associated with these approaches.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes a homogeneous solution of the form y_h = c1 + c2cos(t) + c3sin(t) but encounters difficulties applying the Undetermined Coefficient method and Variation of Parameters.
  • Another participant suggests integrating both sides to simplify the problem to y'' + 1 = C + log(sec(x)).
  • It is noted that the Undetermined Coefficient method may not be applicable since tan(t) is not a suitable function for this method, while Variation of Parameters is asserted to always work, albeit with potential complications in integration.
  • A detailed approach using Variation of Parameters is outlined, involving the formulation of equations for u', v', and w' based on the derivatives of assumed solutions.
  • One participant introduces the operator method as a viable alternative for solving linear differential equations with arbitrary inhomogeneous functions.
  • Another participant expresses surprise at the ability to perform partial fraction decomposition on differential operators, suggesting that the algebraic structure allows for such manipulation.
  • Concerns are raised about the notation used for differential operators, with a suggestion for clearer representation to avoid confusion regarding division.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing opinions on the applicability of the Undetermined Coefficient method, with some asserting its inapplicability while others focus on the effectiveness of Variation of Parameters and the operator method. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the best approach to take.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight potential difficulties with integration in the Variation of Parameters method and the limitations of the Undetermined Coefficient method for this specific equation. The discussion also reflects varying interpretations of notation related to differential operators.

invisible_man
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y''' + y' = tan(t) 0<t<pi

I got yh = c1 + c2cos(t) + c3sin(t)


I'm trying to solve by Undetermined Coefficient method and Variation of Parameters method, but it didn't work
 
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It helps to integrate both sides
y''+1=C+log(sec(x)) thus reducing the problem to
y''+1=f(x)
 
"Undetermined coefficients" won't work here since tangent is not one of the functions you can have as a solution to a differential equation with constant coefficients.

But "variation of parameters" will always work. What did you get? One difficulty is that varation of parameters often leads to undoable integrals- but you can write the solution in terms of the integral.

Since this is a third order equation, you will have to require that all terms involving the first derivative of the unknown functions add to 0 after differentiating both times.

That is, assuming a solution of the form y(t)= u(t)+ v(t)cos(t)+ w(t)sin(t), y'= u'+ v'cos(t)- vsin(t)+ w' sin(t)+ wcos(t). Since, in fact, there are an infinite number of functions, u, v, w, that will work here, we "narrow the search" by requiring that u'+ v'cos(t)+ w'sin(t)= 0.

That leaves y'= -v sin(t)+ w cos(t). Differentiating that y"= -v' sin(t)- v cos(t)+ w' cos(t)- w sin(t). Again, we "narrow the search" by requiring that -v' sin(t)+ w' cos(t)= 0.

That leaves y"= -v cos(t)- w sin(t). Differentiating again, y"'= -v' cos(t)+ v sin(t)- w' sin(t)- w cos(t). Since we had y'= -v sin(t)+ w cos(t), y"'+ y'= -v' cos(t)- w' sin(t). The fact that cos(t) and sin(t) are solutions to the homogeneous differential equation caused all etcept the u' and v' terms to cancel.

Now we have three linear equations for u', v', and w':
u'+ v'cos(t)+ w'sin(t)= 0, -v' sin(t)+ w' cos(t)= 0, and -v' cos(t)- w' sin(t)= tan(t).

Solve those for u', v', and w' and integrate.

Since it has been over a month since this was posted, I will give the solution.

Multiply the equation -v'sin(t)+ w'cos(t)= 0 by sin(t) and the equation -v' cos(t)- w' sin(t)= tan(t) by cos(t) to get
[tex]-v' sin^2(t)+ w'sin(t)cos(t)= 0[/tex]
and
[tex]-v' cos^2(t)- w'sin(t)cos(t)= sin(t)[/tex]

Adding those equations eliminates w' and leaves [itex]-v'= sin(t)[/itex]. Integrating, v(t)= cos(t)+ C. We can take the constant to be 0.
Putting v'= -sin(t) into -v' sin(t)+ w' cos(t)= 0, [itex]sin^2(t)+ w' cos(t)= 0[/itex] so that
[tex]w'= \frac{sin^2(t)}{cos(t)}[/tex]. To integrate that, multiply numerator and denominator by cos(t) to get
[tex]w'= \frac{sin^2(t)}{cos^(t)} cos(t)= \frac{sin^2(t)}{1- sin^2(t)} cos(t)[/itex] <br /> <br /> Letting u= sin(t), we have<br /> [tex]w(t)= \int \frac{sin^2(t)}{1- sin^2(t)} cos(t) dt= \int \frac{u^2}{1- u^2} du= \int -1- u^-2 du[/tex]<br /> [tex]= -u+ u^{-1}+ C= -sin(t)+ \frac{1}{sin(t)}+ C[/tex]<br /> <br /> Putting v'= - sin(t) and [itex]w'= sin^2(t)/cos(t)[/itex] into u'+ v'cos(t)+ w'sin(t)= 0, u'- sin(t)cos(t)+ sin^3(t)/cos(t)= 0, [itex]+ u'= sin(t)cos(t)- sin^3(t)/cos(t)= sin(t)(cos^2(t)- sin^2(t))/cos(t)[/itex]. Integrate that to find u.[/tex]
 
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Have you tried using operator method? It can deal with linear differential equation with arbitrary inhomogeneous function easily.

Here is a reference for the method:

http://www.voofie.com/content/6/introduction-to-differential-equation-and-solving-linear-differential-equations-using-operator-metho/"
 
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ross_tang said:
Have you tried using operator method? It can deal with linear differential equation with arbitrary inhomogeneous function easily.

Here is a reference for the method:

http://www.voofie.com/content/6/introduction-to-differential-equation-and-solving-linear-differential-equations-using-operator-metho/"

Nice! I had no idea this could be done:

[tex]y'''+y'=\tan(t)[/tex]

[tex](D^3+D)y=\tan(t)[/tex]

[tex]D(D^2+1)y=\tan(t)[/tex]

[tex]y=\frac{1}{D(D^2+1)}\tan(t)[/tex]

[tex]y=\frac{1}{D(D-i)(D+i)}\tan(t)[/tex]

[tex]y=\left(\frac{1}{D}-\frac{1}{2}\frac{1}{D-i}-\frac{1}{2}\frac{1}{D+i}\right)\tan(t)[/tex]

thus:

[tex]y=\left(\int \tan(t)+c_1\right)-1/2 e^{it}\left(\int e^{-it}\tan(t)+c_2\right)-1/2 e^{-it}\left(\int e^{it}\tan(t)+c_3\right)[/tex]

which surprising to me, is really the solution when it's back-substituted. :)
 
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I am so glad that you read my tutorial and solved the problem yourself. It is rather strange that you can do a partial fraction on the differential operators. But I think it is just due to the algebraic structure of the differential operator.
 
The notation 1/D, 1/(D - i), and so on is a little misleading, since it implies division, and this is not at all what is going on. Better notation would be D-1 and (D - i)-1, which is suggestive of the inverse.
 

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