What is a Graviton? Reconciling Gravity and Quantum

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    Graviton
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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the concept of the graviton, exploring its nature and relationship with gravity and quantum mechanics. Participants question whether a graviton is an energy quantum, a geometric entity, or a combination of both, and how it fits within the frameworks of general relativity and quantum gravity.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that a graviton could be viewed as the quantum of geometric perturbations, suggesting it contains energy.
  • Others express uncertainty about the reconciliation of quantization with spacetime curvature, noting that a complete quantum gravity theory is still needed.
  • One participant mentions that there is no experimentally verified complete theory of gravity, highlighting the current limitations of general relativity and quantum field theory.
  • There is a discussion about whether the graviton is associated with scalar or tensor perturbations, with some asserting it is related to tensor perturbations like gravitational waves.
  • Some participants question the naming conventions of perturbation quanta, suggesting a humorous alternative name for scalar modes.
  • Concerns are raised about the effectiveness of 'particleizing' forces in providing useful predictions, referencing historical models that may have obfuscated understanding.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach consensus on the nature of the graviton or its role in quantum gravity. Multiple competing views and uncertainties remain regarding its classification and the theoretical frameworks involved.

Contextual Notes

The discussion reflects limitations in current understanding, including unresolved mathematical steps and the dependence on definitions related to quantum gravity and perturbation theory.

TalonD
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is a graviton some kind of energy quantum? how does that reconcile with gravity as the geometry of curved spacetime? Is it energy with little quantum packets? or is it geometry? or is it somehow both? or is it neither and that's just the way we describe it's effects?
 
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I'd say it's the quantum of geometric perturbations. As those contain energy in some way, the graviton does also.
 
TalonD said:
is a graviton some kind of energy quantum? how does that reconcile with gravity as the geometry of curved spacetime? Is it energy with little quantum packets? or is it geometry? or is it somehow both? or is it neither and that's just the way we describe it's effects?

The complete answers to a number of your questions remain unknown, particularly how quantisation is reconciled with space-time curvature. For the details we need to work out a decent qauntum gravity theory. There is no empirical proof of the existence of 'gravitons' and maybe they won't even be needed by whatever theory (hopefully!) one day answers your interesting questions.
 
This is subject of a number of threads. On the one below I tried to get an answer at my level, for both the possibility of an understandable and not too mathematical explanation, and because of the striking confidence of physicists that they know at least one property of this particle which they are not expecting to see any time soon.

In summary no one was very positive about the possibility of explanation satisfying my criteria, but it can surely be left open for any attempts. :smile:




https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=231225&highlight=Graviton
 
As noted, there is no absolute experimentally verified complete theory of gravity...general relativity and quantum field theory, quantum gravity,etc is about as good as it gets ...Wikipedia does a decent job of describing gravitons at

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graviton

and also references experimental efforts to detect gravitational waves
 
Ich said:
I'd say it's the quantum of geometric perturbations. As those contain energy in some way, the graviton does also.

sorry for a stupid question. Is it the quantum for Scalar perturbation or tensor perturbation?
I guess they should be treated differently?thank you.
 
The graviton is the only* particle predicted by the standard model which has not yet been detected. It is theorized to be a spin 2 particle that mediates the gravitational "force". As noted, QM and General relativity have not been reconciled with each other, and we don't have a good quantum theory of gravity.

*Disclaimer: I'm not sure about this statement, I think it's true but I may be wrong.
 
Matterwave said:
The graviton is the only* particle predicted by the standard model which has not yet been detected. It is theorized to be a spin 2 particle that mediates the gravitational "force". As noted, QM and General relativity have not been reconciled with each other, and we don't have a good quantum theory of gravity.

*Disclaimer: I'm not sure about this statement, I think it's true but I may be wrong.

no,sir. standard model does not include graviton. Or else most people here should pack up and looking for new jobs. :-)
 
Is it the quantum for Scalar perturbation or tensor perturbation?
Tensor, like gravitational waves. Spin 2.
 
  • #10
Ich said:
Tensor, like gravitational waves. Spin 2.

thank you!
But why scalar mode perturbation quantum do not have a name ? They do exist in the calculation of primodial perturbations.for example, quanta of mukhanov variable.
Can we call it gravikachu ? pikachu pikachu
1228036664928.jpg
 
  • #11
'Particalizing' forces of nature enjoyed great success in the early days of QM, and led to string theory. Neither proposition has accomplished much more than obfuscation. Useful predictions do not necessarily validate the model. See Ptolemy.
 

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