Who Conceived the Concept of Atoms and Are There Undiscovered Forces?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the historical conception of atoms and the idea of undiscovered forces in physics. Participants explore the implications of atomic theory, the nature of scientific inquiry, and the validity of various models in explaining physical phenomena.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the value of pursuing atomic theory, suggesting that there may be countless undiscovered forces at play that are not accounted for by current models.
  • Another participant defends the scientific method, arguing that hypotheses about atoms lead to predictions that can be tested experimentally, thus providing credibility to the atomic model.
  • There is a suggestion that alternative explanations, such as the existence of "ghosts," could be considered, although this is met with skepticism regarding its applicability to established scientific models.
  • Some participants express frustration with the direction of the conversation, indicating that it may not be productive or grounded in established scientific understanding.
  • Concerns are raised about the practical applications of atomic theory in fields such as medicine and technology, emphasizing its relevance and effectiveness in real-world scenarios.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants exhibit a range of views, with some defending the atomic model and its scientific basis, while others express skepticism and propose alternative ideas. The discussion remains unresolved, with no consensus on the validity of the atomic theory or the existence of undiscovered forces.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference various scientific applications and theories, but there is a lack of clarity on the assumptions underlying their arguments. The discussion includes speculative ideas that are not substantiated by established scientific principles.

THX22
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Who came up with the idea of an atom? It begs the question why do such people waste their time on this when they know they can never really find out what's going on? I bet instead of the four known forces there are litterally hundreds of millions of 'forces' each binding everything on such a small scale that they are nearly invisible.
 
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THX22 said:
Who came up with the idea of an atom? It begs the question why do such people waste their time on this when they know they can never really find out what's going on? I bet instead of the four known forces there are litterally hundreds of millions of 'forces' each binding everything on such a small scale that they are nearly invisible.

Seems you've missed the essential drive of science: prediction and comparison with experiment. If, by making certain hypotheses, you arrive at predicting how certain experimental results should turn out, and this happens indeed, then this gives some credibility to the value of your hypotheses (without ever being definitive).

With atoms, that's the same. You start by saying "assume that matter is made up of atoms, and that they behave in this and that way"... this allows you to build a mathematical model (with more or less sophistication) of what SHOULD happen if it were indeed true that matter is made up of atoms. That mathematical model makes then certain predictions. When you go and verify them in the lab, and it works out correctly, that's then something that gives credibility to your original hypothesis of "assume that matter is made up of atoms".
When you think about this, about ALL you know has been established that way - unless you took it on faith.
 
What if there's just a ghost moving through them...
 
THX22 said:
What if there's just a ghost moving through them...

And you think these "ghosts" are the model we use to design the semiconductors that you are currently using in your modern electronics, including the computer you are currently using? Or what about the research in the medicine and biochemistry that you or your family are benefiting if, heaven forbid, one of you become sick? What do you think is the fundamental model in all those studies? Ghosts?

Zz.

[I see this thread going nowhere fast]
 
Well atleast at some place they can be claimed to be ghosts..like
they can be ghosts in the form of atom bombs
 
THX, are you interested in learning how these theories came about and why they are solid, or are you more interested in espousing your own views?
 
ZapperZ said:
[I see this thread going nowhere fast]
It went from zero to nowhere in one post. That's pretty darned fast.

THX22 said:
It begs the question why do such people waste their time on this when they know they can never really find out what's going on?
Because the theory works very well up to this point. I will be waiting for your independently published works that will dubunk the notion of the atom as we know it to be.
 
THX22 said:
It begs the question why do such people waste their time on this...

Have you or a loved one even been in a medical situation that required X-rays, or an MRI, or perhaps radiation therapy for cancer?
Those of us who have can gratefully thank the efforts of nuclear science.
 
No one can escape the ghost...
 
  • #10
THX22 said:
No one can escape the ghost...

Hey, look, another garbage thread from THX22. Wave bye-bye, THX22.

- Warren
 

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