Why can't I find this group anywhere online?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around identifying a specific non-Abelian group of order 8 based on a provided Cayley table. Participants explore the properties of the group, compare it to known groups, and address discrepancies in the Cayley table's representation.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents a Cayley table for a non-Abelian group of order 8, noting it has two generators and three self-inverses apart from the identity.
  • Another participant suggests that there are two known non-Abelian groups of order 8: the dihedral group ##D_4## and the quaternion group, leaving it to the original poster to determine which matches their table.
  • A participant points out that the Cayley table does not align with the Cayley graph, specifically mentioning that ##b^2 = d## rather than the identity.
  • The original poster expresses frustration that neither the dihedral group nor the quaternion group matches their table, citing the number of self-inverses as a distinguishing factor.
  • Another participant asserts that the Cayley table fails to satisfy associativity, providing an example to illustrate the inconsistency.
  • One participant confirms that there are five groups of order 8, including both Abelian and non-Abelian groups, which may imply limitations on the possible structures that can exist.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the identity of the group in question. There are competing views regarding the validity of the Cayley table and its alignment with known groups.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved issues regarding the correctness of the Cayley table, including potential violations of group properties such as associativity. The discussion highlights the complexity of group identification based on structural properties.

davidbenari
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http://i.imgur.com/JgpJp03.png

I've done the Cayley table for the group above and can't find it in any of the group encyclopedias online. I can post it too if you want, but I'll tell you this:

It is a non abelian group of order 8 with two generators (a,g) such that a^4=Identity and g^4=identity. Plus, it only has three self inverses (apart from the identity).

No group seems to satisfy this. Anyone knows which group I'm talking about?

Should I post the Cayley table I've done too?edit:

And here is the Cayley table http://i.imgur.com/VKJr18F.jpg
 
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If you do a little searching, you will find that there are two non-Abelian groups of order 8. The dihedral group ##D_4## and the quaternion group. I will let you figure out which one is the correct one.
 
Also, your Cayley table does not match the Cayley graph. For example, ##b^2 = d## and not the identity.
 
Hmm. I'm checking that ##b^2=d##. For what its worth, I had already checked ##D_4## and the quaternion group and neither match my table. ##D_4## has 6 self inverses, the quaternion group has ##2## (I'm including the identity here).

Even if ##b^2=d## and my Cayley table is a wrong representation of the diagram, the Cayley table I've shown look quite legit and its making me crazy why I can't find it online.:mad:
By the way, and this might be a dumb question, but how did you figure out ##b^2=d##?
 
I've figured out ##b^2=d## now. Just for the heck of it, as I said, the Cayley table looks legit so why shouldn't it be online? My opinion is that there is something wrong somewhere with my table. After all, it is a proven fact that there is only a certain quantity of groups of order 8, right?
 
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Your Cayley table does not satisfy associativity. For example, ##(ba)g = 1## while ##b(ag) = d##. Therefore, it does not describe the multiplication table of a group.
 
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And yes, there are only five groups (up to isomorphisms) of order 8. They are the Abelian groups ##C_8##, ##C_4\times C_2##, and ##C_2^3## and the non-Abelian groups already mentioned.
 
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