Why Do Stars Show Both Emission and Absorption Spectra?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the phenomena of emission and absorption spectra in stars, exploring the conditions under which these spectra are observed and the implications of temperature and density in stellar atmospheres. Participants examine the relationship between temperature, light emission, and the behavior of elements in different states within stars.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants note that heating elements like sodium results in specific wavelengths of light, but caution that conditions such as pressure can alter this behavior.
  • There is a discussion on how hotter stars emit shorter wavelengths and whether stars, primarily composed of hydrogen, should only show colors from hydrogen's emission spectrum.
  • Participants question why absorption spectra show gaps for elements that are also heated in the sun, suggesting a need for clarification on the roles of different layers in stars.
  • One participant proposes that the outer layers of stars are cooler and may absorb light emitted from hotter inner layers, leading to the observed absorption spectrum.
  • Another participant explains that emission primarily comes from the plasma in stars, which behaves like a blackbody, while the atmosphere contributes to the discrete absorption spectrum.
  • There is mention of specific absorption lines, such as the Sodium "D" lines, and how they can be influenced by both absorption and emission from different layers of the star.
  • Concerns are raised about the outer layers being hot enough to emit light, but it is suggested that their emission is less than what they absorb, complicating the overall spectrum.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express various viewpoints on the mechanisms behind emission and absorption spectra, indicating that multiple competing views remain. The discussion does not reach a consensus on the exact processes involved.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the influence of temperature, pressure, and atomic interactions on the observed spectra, indicating that assumptions about the behavior of elements in different states may not be universally applicable.

Nishantkumar19
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When you heat things up, they emit specific wavelengths of light, right? Like when you heat up sodium, it emits yellow.

But don't things emit shorter wavelengths of light at higher temperatures? Like how hotter stars are blue and colder stars are yellow. Since stars are mostly hydrogen, shouldn't they be a mixture of just the colors we see in Hydrogen's emission spectrum?

When we see an absorption spectrum of sunlight, there are black gaps for the different elements. But those same elements are heated up in the sun, so they should be emitting light too, right?

Is it that the outer layers of stars are cooler? So the inner layers emit the light, and the outer layers block specific wavelengths of light by absorbing and then scattering them? But surely even the outer layers would be hot enough to be emitting their own light, right?

Please help!
 
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Nishantkumar19 said:
When you heat things up, they emit specific wavelengths of light, right? Like when you heat up sodium, it emits yellow.
Be careful here: that is the case of you heat up a low-pressure sodium vapor. In other words, you have to be in conditions where atoms can still be seen as independent of one another. Simply going to high pressures, where collisions between atoms is more important, will give light that is closer to white. The Wikipedia article on sodium vapor lamps has nice illustrations.

Nishantkumar19 said:
But don't things emit shorter wavelengths of light at higher temperatures? Like how hotter stars are blue and colder stars are yellow. Since stars are mostly hydrogen, shouldn't they be a mixture of just the colors we see in Hydrogen's emission spectrum?
Shorter wavelengths are due to higher-energy electronic excitations. Again, because of the conditions in which the atoms are, each line gets broaden due to collisions, the Doppler effect, etc. Also, in the case of a star, you have a plasma, where many atoms are ionized: it is not only hydrogen (and helium) atoms anymore. Stars are almost perfect blackbodies.
Nishantkumar19 said:
When we see an absorption spectrum of sunlight, there are black gaps for the different elements. But those same elements are heated up in the sun, so they should be emitting light too, right?

Is it that the outer layers of stars are cooler? So the inner layers emit the light, and the outer layers block specific wavelengths of light by absorbing and then scattering them? But surely even the outer layers would be hot enough to be emitting their own light, right?
Emission is mostly from the plasma, which gives wide-spectrum blackbody radiation. That light passes through the star's atmosphere, which is much less dense and atoms can be seen as independent, that's why you get a discrete absorption spectrum. There will be also emission due to the atmosphere, but it is isotropic, so overall there is light "missing." This is the same thing you get in absorption spectroscopy in the lab.
 
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Alright that clears it up a lot. Thanks!
 
Nishantkumar19 said:
Is it that the outer layers of stars are cooler?
It depends on the line. Some absorption lines are due to scattering, as already explained above, but others (like the famous Sodium "D" lines in the Sun) are due to absorption of the light from the hotter photosphere and replacing it with emission from cooler regions overlying the photosphere, just as you are thinking. Indeed, some lines even receive contribution from the chromosphere, which is hotter than the photosphere, and when the chromosphere gets thick enough (as can happen in solar flares), these lines are actually seen in emission.
So the inner layers emit the light, and the outer layers block specific wavelengths of light by absorbing and then scattering them? But surely even the outer layers would be hot enough to be emitting their own light, right?
Yes, but it's less than what they absorb, if the temperature is lower, and scattering always reduces the light because it bounces some of the light back down were it can be reabsorbed.
 

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