Why so few Relativity/Gravity groups in the US?

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In summary: GR/Relativity is one such module.The US has a huge range of options for postgraduate research in GR/Cosmology/Gravitation/High Energy/etc.I was curious if it was just "me" or if studying GR was more "standard" in the UK.It seems like doing your research on relativity and gravity is much more common there as well.
  • #1
Troponin
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Why are there so few research groups that focus on relativity and gravity in the US?

It may be only my perception, but it seems that studying general relativity is rather "standard" in the UK. The schools I've looked at all seem to have a few classes on relativity at the undergraduate level. At the graduate level, it seems like doing your research on relativity and gravity is much more common there as well. If you search for graduate schools in "cosmology/relativity/gravity" in the US-News grad school rankings, it only lists 12 schools with any kind of program in the entire US, and the "top 10" are pretty much all "top 10" schools for Physics in general, i.e., the kind of schools with HUGE physics departments with plenty of areas of research.
Looking at the top 10 listed...you can't really "bank" on being accepted to anyone...regardless of your application caliber.Again, it may be only my perception...but are your choices really pretty limited if you want to focus on some form of geometric physics (relativity, gravity, cosmology, etc) in graduate school in the US?If so, does anyone know why it is that way (US vs UK)?
 
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  • #2
Troponin said:
...it seems like doing your research on relativity and gravity is much more common there as well.
Curious - I would also be interested in any answers to this question.
 
  • #3
There are plenty of institutions in the US that do research on GR-related areas from Gravitational Waves (US having a huge involvement in GW projects such as LISA and LIGO) to CMB related areas (think WMAP/Planck - i.e. constraining models for early universe using observations, the kind of theory work that ties in with observations).

Some random examples:
http://physics.fau.edu/research/faust/members.php" [Broken]
http://www.gravity.phys.uwm.edu/" [Broken]
http://www.physics.unc.edu/research/theory/gchep/" [Broken]
http://www.lsa.umich.edu/umich/v/index.jsp?vgnextoid=cdc820ffcbcfc11020ffcbcfc1109db1d38dRCRD&linkTypeBegin=channellinkTypeEnd&assetNameBegin=AstrophysicsassetNameEnd#astrosubfields" [Broken]

These guys do work on areas that use GR. Not sure what you're expecting though?

The US has a huge range of options for postgraduate research in GR/Cosmology/Gravitation/High Energy/etc.

As for UK students taking a GR course, it would be fairly typical for Msc/MPhys students to have done an introductory course with many schools offering enough of the basics for 'relativistic astrophysics' but not enough to do any serious GR/Cosmology theory. This seems pretty similar to the US system though with many universities offering a course in GR/Relativity, especially at Masters level.
 
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  • #4
I really wouldn't use US News to look for specific topics - what you should be doing is finding out where the top researchers are working. I know Montana State has a good gravity group and it's not too hard to get into; Penn State has a group as well.
 
  • #5
I'm definitely going to follow this thread. It is very relevant to my interests. Thanks guys!

My local school has an amazing Optics/Laser program if anyone is looking for that.
 
  • #6
eri said:
I really wouldn't use US News to look for specific topics - what you should be doing is finding out where the top researchers are working. I know Montana State has a good gravity group and it's not too hard to get into; Penn State has a group as well.

Re-reading my post...I don't know that I worded myself well.

I was curious if it was just "me" or if studying GR was more "standard" in the UK.

My own feeling from seeing the curriculum of various schools (from looking online myself, visiting sites like this, and searching for GR lecture notes online) it seems like the US has the standard of:
Every undergraduate physics student studies quantum, usually two courses, but everyone takes at least one.

While the UK has the standard of:
Every undergraduate physics/maths student studies quantum AND relativity (in the way that only QM is "standard" in the US), which leads to many more graduate students focusing their research on relativity/gravity.


Like I said, I may be wrong, but I don't know of any US physics programs without course(s) in QM, but many of them have no GR course at all (my university).

Every UK program I've seen (admittedly, this is far from all of them) has at least one QM and GR in the undergrad curriculum.
 
  • #7
In part the way the UK syllabus is structured is due to the requirement that a physics degree be accredited by the Institute of Physics. If you take a look at the website (http://www.iop.org/education/higher_education/accreditation/page_43310.html) and in particular the document towards the bottom of the page "The Physics Degree" pdf then it will outline the core syllabus that UK undergrads go through.

On top of that there will be variations from university to university often relating to a departments research interests or the type of degree you pursue (e.g. Astrophysics, Theoretical, Applied, Computational). In order to differentiate between a BSc and an MPhys degree (for example) it is often required that the course offer modules beyond the typical syllabus that a BSc student takes and this is quite often in the form of a module on General Relativity, Advanced Quantum Theory/Quantum Field Theory, Particles, Advanced Astro Topics (e.g. Early-Universe Cosmology, ISM, Advanced Stellar, Astrophysical Fluids, etc).

I'm not quite sure if the US has this type of degree accreditation in which degrees across the universities have to satisfy a basic core syllabus but in practice nearly all physics degree will follow this type of syllabus as it outlines the basics for any further physics you choose to do.

Hope that helps, :)
 
  • #8
Physics degrees in the US don't have any special accreditation other than the normal one the school needs. It's true that GR is rarely taught at the undergrad level (and not always taught at the graduate level either) but the different in the way US and UK programs work means that even though US students spend longer in college, they take fewer physics classes than UK students for the same degree.
 
  • #9
US schools also have gen-ed requirements, UK schools do not. In the UK, a 4 year degree means 4 years of physics (well, maths as well). Though many universities do offer GR at undergraduate level, I'm not convinced it is a good idea. It is a graduate level topic.
 

1. Why is there a lack of Relativity/Gravity research groups in the US?

The field of Relativity/Gravity is a highly specialized and complex area of study. It requires advanced knowledge and equipment, making it difficult for universities or research institutions to establish dedicated research groups. Additionally, funding for such groups may be limited compared to other areas of science.

2. Are there any notable Relativity/Gravity groups in the US?

While there may not be a large number of dedicated Relativity/Gravity groups in the US, there are certainly notable groups and researchers in this field. Some of the top institutions for Relativity/Gravity research in the US include the California Institute of Technology, Massachusetts Institute of Technology, and Princeton University.

3. Is the lack of Relativity/Gravity groups in the US a reflection of the quality of research in this field?

No, the lack of dedicated research groups in the US does not reflect the quality of research in the field of Relativity/Gravity. In fact, many groundbreaking discoveries and advancements in Relativity/Gravity have been made by researchers in the US, despite the smaller number of dedicated groups.

4. What efforts are being made to increase the number of Relativity/Gravity groups in the US?

There are various efforts being made to promote and support Relativity/Gravity research in the US. For example, organizations such as the American Physical Society and the National Science Foundation provide funding and resources for researchers in this field. Additionally, universities may establish interdisciplinary research centers that include Relativity/Gravity as one of their focus areas.

5. How can individuals interested in Relativity/Gravity research get involved in the US?

There are several ways for individuals to get involved in Relativity/Gravity research in the US. They can pursue advanced degrees in physics or astronomy at universities with strong Relativity/Gravity programs, seek out research opportunities at institutions with dedicated groups, or attend conferences and workshops to network with researchers in this field. Additionally, individuals can contribute to the field through independent research or collaborations with existing groups.

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