The most fundamental physics that we can observe directly with our senses?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around identifying the most fundamental aspects of physics that can be directly observed through human senses. Participants explore various phenomena and interpretations of what constitutes "fundamental" in the context of physics.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest that the photochemical effect of light triggering a retinal response could be a candidate for the most fundamental observable phenomenon, alongside gravity.
  • One participant proposes that defining "fundamental" is crucial, arguing that directly observable data represents the lowest level of physics, while higher abstractions may be considered more fundamental but are further removed from sensory data.
  • Another participant notes that the minimum light observable by the human eye is around two or three photons, and discusses optical phenomena like rainbows in oil slicks as examples of fundamental observations.
  • A later reply emphasizes the importance of relating observable phenomena to physics, questioning how one might recognize such phenomena instantly.
  • One participant defines "fundamental" as something that is simply and beautifully expressed by mathematics.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on what constitutes the most fundamental physics observable by the senses, with multiple competing views and interpretations of "fundamental" being presented.

Contextual Notes

There are varying definitions of "fundamental" and differing opinions on what constitutes direct observation, which may affect the discussion's conclusions.

Loren Booda
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What is the most fundamental physics that we can observe directly with our senses?
 
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Loren Booda said:
What is the most fundamental physics that we can observe directly with our senses?
If you mean the smallest phenomenon that can be detected, I would submit that the photochemical effect of light triggering a retinal response would be a good candidate. One could also argue for gravity.
 
I think you need to define what you mean by "fundamental".

My opinion is that everything we observe directly is the lowest level of what physics is. You can think of it as a logical pyramid; directly observable data is in the lowest level, and we build models that allow us to list fewer and fewer "principles" after each abstraction. The upper "logical levels" may be regarded as "more fundamental", but are also necessarily more distant from the raw data from our senses.
 
Loren Booda said:
What is the most fundamental physics that we can observe directly with our senses?

Observe ? Light
 
There are many optic phenomena that are pretty close to fundamental. The minimum light you can observe with your eyes is on the order of two or three photons. When you see rainbows in oil slicks you are seeing the macroscopic effects of microscopic scale films. The famous drop two objects at the same time experiment is a good illustration of the geodesic nature of gravity -- i.e. that it is independent of mass.
 
Umm, people didnt actually know what is physics until someone define what is physics.
So i would like to think this way... What kind of phenomena will instantly let u relate it to physics?
 
By fundamental I mean simply and beautifully expressed by mathematics.
 

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