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Conductivity of Ne

by Intuitive
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Intuitive
#1
Feb6-06, 03:34 PM
P: 271
Hi Zz.

I know that this is one of your specialties so here it is.

I have a question that is bugging me.

Using Bohr's Atom as a model for the Question.

The difference in electrical conductivity between pure Gases Neon and Condensed pure Solid Neon (frozen), is there a difference in the conductivity between these two states of Neon?

I am not sure if the 0 Conductivity in Neon is because it was measured as a gas or Liquid. (Periodic Table Referenced) and not measured as a solid (frozen).

If there is a difference then what would the difference be in conductivity?

Would the outer P6 Orbital in 2s'2'P6(Neon) be responsible for any difference in conductivity if the Neon is condensed to a pure solid?

If there is a difference then I have something that I may want to post about condensed Electron multi pairing (besides Cooper Pairing) but only until you can confirm a difference in conductivity between states.

I am sorry I don't have the Lab Equipment to test pure solid Neon's electrical conductivity.
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Gokul43201
#2
Feb6-06, 05:53 PM
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Quote Quote by Intuitive
Using Bohr's Atom as a model for the Question.
The Bohr model can not say anything about the electrical properties of a large number of atoms...because it doesn't attempt to. In fact, it fails to even describe a single neon atom with any degree of accuracy.
ZapperZ
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Feb6-06, 06:11 PM
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I just want to know what is meant by an "electrical conductivity" of a neutral gas. How about defining that first?

Zz.

Intuitive
#4
Feb6-06, 06:47 PM
P: 271
Conductivity of Ne

Maybe Bohr's Atom was a bad example for my Question. Sorry.

In the Periodic Table, every Table that I have read so far shows Neon as having Zero electrical conductivity, I would assume this was tested by some form of Ohm meter test, But is the electrical conductivity for Neon tested as a Gas/Liquid or in its solid frozen state?

I don't feel safe when assuming but I have no choice at the moment.

I was curious as to whether Neons Outer P6 Orbital Electrons will conduct transmitted electrons across its surface when Neon becomes a condensed frozen solid.

It bugged me because Neon, Argon, Krypton, Xenon, Radon, Ununoctium were the only Elements that contained more than one or two outer Electrons filling the most outer orbits.

It got me bugged why these Elements were 0 in Electrical conductivity in the periodic Table, and I came to the Assumption that the 0 electrical conductance had to do with the testing of none (Frozen) Noble Gas testing.

It seems like, Strictly through intuition that these Noble Gases should be extremely good electrical conductors at frozen temperature states because the outer Electrons (may) form multi-sets of Cooper paired Electrons in the outer orbital.

I will let you take over from here because I really don't have any evidence of this and no Lab for testing any of this.

If this topic is rediculious in any manner please let me know and I will kindly delete this posting, I know my Science is not as keen as yours and that's why I am asking, But for me, You guys have made me understand a lot and I learn something new everyday since I have been here.

Thanks.
inha
#5
Feb7-06, 01:55 AM
P: 576
Quote Quote by Intuitive
It seems like, Strictly through intuition that these Noble Gases should be extremely good electrical conductors at frozen temperature states because the outer Electrons (may) form multi-sets of Cooper paired Electrons in the outer orbital.
Cooper pairs take more than just the presence of electrons and cold temperatures to form. And how on earth would the pairs even conduct electricity if they were bound into atoms?!?
Gokul43201
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Feb7-06, 03:12 AM
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Quote Quote by Intuitive
Maybe Bohr's Atom was a bad example for my Question. Sorry.

In the Periodic Table, every Table that I have read so far shows Neon as having Zero electrical conductivity, I would assume this was tested by some form of Ohm meter test, But is the electrical conductivity for Neon tested as a Gas/Liquid or in its solid frozen state?
The electrical conductivity of any gas (oxygen, nitrogen, fluorine, carbon dioxide, etc.) is zero and will be reported as such in a periodic table or other reference. Gases do not conduct electricity at low/moderate fields. Conduction is a property of a macroscopic number of interacting atoms (solids/liquids); gases are made up of essentially non-interacting atoms that retain their individual characteristics. Above some large, critical potential (the ionization potential of the gas) the gas becomes a plasma, which is an excellent conductor.

I don't feel safe when assuming but I have no choice at the moment.

I was curious as to whether Neons Outer P6 Orbital Electrons will conduct transmitted electrons across its surface when Neon becomes a condensed frozen solid.
In the solid state, neon is an insulator (or semi-conductor at best). It has an electrical conductivity that is at least 10,000 times smaller than iron.

It bugged me because Neon, Argon, Krypton, Xenon, Radon, Ununoctium were the only Elements that contained more than one or two outer Electrons filling the most outer orbits.
This is not true. While the noble gases do have a large number of valence electrons, so do the transition metals (the outermost d-electrons have higher energy than the outer s-electrons). In fact, except for the alkali metals (Li, Na, K, Rb, Cs, Fr), all other elements have more than 1 valence electron. Furthermore, the number of valence electrons is hardly the only thing that determines whether something will be a good conductor.

It got me bugged why these Elements were 0 in Electrical conductivity in the periodic Table, and I came to the Assumption that the 0 electrical conductance had to do with the testing of none (Frozen) Noble Gas testing.
I don't understand what you've written here but I imagine this is answered in my first paragraph.

It seems like, Strictly through intuition that these Noble Gases should be extremely good electrical conductors at frozen temperature states because the outer Electrons (may) form multi-sets of Cooper paired Electrons in the outer orbital.
You can not tell from intuition that something will form cooper pairs. This is a highly non-intuitive and highly non-trivial calculation. The only thing that is fairly intuitive about it (to perhaps, someone who has studied superconductivity) is that you can expect, for the most part, that something which is a good electrical conductor (at normal temperatures) is less likely to form Cooper pairs (at some lower temperature) than things which are poor conductors.

To be able to figure out when Cooper pairing happens is stuff that has won people Nobel Prizes. This is not something that follows out of high-school intuition.
Intuitive
#7
Feb7-06, 03:45 PM
P: 271
This was the actual experiment I wanted to try.

Thanks for all your info about this subject, it helped a lot.
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