Quantum Mechanics Operator Commutation Relations

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the commutation relations of quantum mechanics (QM) operators, focusing on both non-relativistic and relativistic contexts. Participants explore the necessity of tables for these relations and the derivation of specific commutation relations, including those related to spin and angular momentum.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant inquires about the existence of tables showing commutation relations for all QM operators.
  • Another participant asserts that commutation relations can be derived from the fundamental relation [x,p]=iħ, suggesting that a table may not be necessary.
  • Some participants note that additional relations are needed for relativistic quantum physics and spin, indicating the complexity of the topic.
  • A participant expresses satisfaction in observing the similarities among classical QM relations, suggesting that a table is redundant.
  • One participant introduces the idea that the generators of rotation and boost form the algebra SO(3,1) or SU(2) x SU(2), which could be an interesting point for discussion.
  • Another participant emphasizes the importance of understanding Lie algebras to fully grasp the implications of the algebraic structures mentioned.
  • There is a discussion about the necessity of including spin commutation relations, as they are not derived from position and momentum operators.
  • Participants agree that while orbital angular momentum relations can be derived similarly, spin operators must be considered separately as fundamental commutators.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the derivability of commutation relations from fundamental principles, but there is disagreement on the necessity of tables and the completeness of the relations discussed, particularly regarding spin and relativistic contexts.

Contextual Notes

Some limitations include the dependence on definitions of operators and the varying contexts (non-relativistic vs. relativistic) that influence the discussion of commutation relations.

rick1138
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Does anyone know of any tables that show the commutation relations of all QM opeartors? Any information would be appreciated.
 
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You don't need a table, they can all be derived simply from

[tex][x,p]=i\hbar[/tex]

That's the beauty of physics and the thing that distinguishes it from Botany or stamp collecting.

You may need a couple more for relativistic quantum physics and spin, but since you didn't specify I am assuming you mean non-relativistic QM.
 
You may need a couple more for relativistic quantum physics and spin- Slyboy

Yes indeed. There are some important commutation relations involving rotations and boosts.
 
I was looking for non-relativistic, just wondered if such a thing existed. The matrical rep of the Serret-Frenet formulae is very neat because it makes them very easy to remember. Now that I've looked at all the classical QM relations together at once I see that, as Slyboy stated a table is not really necessary, because they are all so similar. Thanks everyone.
 
I can't resist adding-

But if you had been looking for relativistic commutation relations, one way to sum up the relations for generators of rotation J and generators of boost K are that they form the algebra SO(3,1), or equivalently SU(2) x SU(2).

Tell that to your friends to impress them. :approve:
 
Tell that to your friends to impress them.

but perhaps you should read a book on Lie algebras first, just in case any of them know what you are talking about. :biggrin:
 
I've read about 20 books on Lie Algebras and Superalgebras - I know more math than physics.
 
slyboy said:
You don't need a table, they can all be derived simply from

[tex][x,p]=i\hbar[/tex]

Well, you'd also need to know that [itex][x_i,x_j]=0[/itex] and [itex][p_i,p_j]=0[/itex].

You may need a couple more for relativistic quantum physics and spin, but since you didn't specify I am assuming you mean non-relativistic QM.

Yes, and you need the commutators for spin even in nonrelativistic QM, since spin is not derived from x and p.
 
Yes, and you need the commutators for spin even in nonrelativistic QM, since spin is not derived from x and p.

Yes, but you can derive the relations for orbital angular momentum and they are essentially the same.
 
  • #10
slyboy said:
Yes, but you can derive the relations for orbital angular momentum and they are essentially the same.

They're exactly the same, but that's not the point. The point is that spin isn't a function of x and p, and so the commutators for the spin operators must be added to the set of "fundamental" commutators.
 

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