
#1
Nov1309, 01:22 PM

P: 74

Let's say all things are known in the Universe and magic doesn't exist, then:
K is the set of all things known and Magic, M, doesn't exist. M [tex]\notin[/tex] {K} Let {[tex]\neg[/tex] K} be all things not known. {[tex]\neg[/tex] K} [tex]\notin[/tex] {K} Since Magic can not be defined by {K} Then M [tex]\in[/tex] {[tex]\neg[/tex] K} by default since {[tex]\neg[/tex] K} is the set of what can not be defined by {K} Because the first premise is absurd, not all is known about the universe then the set {[tex]\neg[/tex] K} is real and magic is a form of unknown which belongs to the set of {[tex]\neg[/tex] K}. Any comments or suggestions as to how to make this a better proof would be appreciated, thanks. Also is there any other similar proof of magic? 



#2
Nov1309, 03:07 PM

P: 46

1. If magic doesn't exist then it cannot be an element of anything, or in other words magic cannot belong to any set.
2. The set {[tex]\neg[/tex]K} is equal to the empty set since all things in the universe are known and therefore nothing is unknown. 3. The empty set has no elements and M cannot belong to any set, therefore M [tex]\notin[/tex] {[tex]\neg[/tex]K}. 4. Therefore there is no contradiction and your proof is flawed. 



#3
Nov1309, 03:14 PM

P: 16

Surely this 'proof' just states that M doesn't exist so it is in {¬K} which contains all that is not in {K}
Then when you debunk the original statement as 'absurd', you claim {K} is not all that is known so {¬K} is no longer all that isn't real, it also contains elements whose reality are unknown, as not everything is known. All in all, you've proved you don't know whether magic is real or not. 



#4
Nov1309, 04:35 PM

P: 74

Mathematical proof of MagicSo: All things are known in the Universe, {K}, and "Magic, M, is undefinable" from all that is known, therefore: {K} [tex]\subset[/tex] {AllInfo}, M [tex]\notin[/tex] {K} but, M [tex]\in[/tex] {AllInfo} [tex]\notin[/tex] {K} Since the first premise of {K} is absurd it therfore is contained by {AllInfo} but is not equal to {AllInfo}. Since M is definable by {Allinfo} it is real. 



#5
Nov1309, 07:23 PM

P: 46

^^You have to assume that magic exists for it to be an element of the set of all information.
Also you are forgetting that {AllInfo}[tex]\subset[/tex] {K} since all things in the universe are known. therefore {AllInfo} = {K}. Your proof is actually proving that magic does not exist. if you assume that magic cannot be defined in k. 



#6
Nov1309, 08:01 PM

P: 74

{AllInfo} [tex]\neq[/tex] {K} because not all information in the universe is precievable or even from what can be precieved completely understood. e.g. Quantum weirdness. So magic is possible we just don't understand it. 



#7
Nov1309, 08:24 PM

P: 74

Also by defining Magic as the inexplicable in the "indeterminate Universe". I believe that would imply "Magic" as an element of the set {AllInfo} and exculd it from the set {K}. 



#8
Nov1309, 09:01 PM

PF Gold
P: 40

If you're trying for a proof by contradiction, you would have to either 1. assume magic exists, then logically show that magic existing leads to a contradiction (proving that it can't exist) or 2. assume magic does not exist, then logically show that magic not existing leads to a contradiction (proving that it must exist) Using what you've written so far, the best you can hope for is (in my opinion) to maybe show that we don't know everything in the universe, or that magic may (or may not) exist. 


Register to reply 
Related Discussions  
Mathematical Proof  Beyond the Standard Model  16  
Mathematical proof  Math & Science Software  5  
E=mc2:Mathematical Proof of the Reality of God  Math & Science Software  3  
Mathematical Proof  Math & Science Software  6  
Mathematical Proof???  Math & Science Software  10 