Accelerating charged particles and FOR

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the emission of electromagnetic radiation by charged particles, particularly electrons, when they are accelerated. It explores the perspectives of different observers in varying reference frames and the implications for conservation laws in physics.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant posits that a stationary electron on Earth does not emit EM radiation, but an observer in space would see it as accelerating and questions whether any EM radiation is emitted from that perspective.
  • Another participant agrees with the initial claim, suggesting that photon number is not conserved across different coordinate transformations, leading to discrepancies in observed photon counts between accelerated and non-accelerated frames.
  • A further inquiry is made regarding whether the photons observed by the external observer can be utilized constructively and if this scenario violates conservation of energy principles.
  • There is a question raised about the fundamental reason why charged particles emit light when accelerated.
  • One participant references applets demonstrating the electric field lines of an accelerating charge, noting that these lines become "kinked" and suggesting a connection to radiation emission, while expressing uncertainty about the explanation of this phenomenon.
  • The Lamor formula is mentioned as a detailed explanation for the behavior of an accelerating charge.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the implications of photon emission and conservation laws, indicating that multiple competing perspectives remain without a clear consensus on the underlying principles.

Contextual Notes

Participants have not resolved the implications of photon emission in relation to conservation of energy, nor have they clarified the connection between the kinking of electric field lines and radiation emission.

raymes_k
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if, say, an electron is stationary on Earth (ignore the probability or possibility of this for now). it, of course, is not emitting any EM radiation. However, an observer in space (stationary with reference to the sun) is looking at the electron. relative to them, the electron is accelerating (circular motion around the earth). is any EM radiation emitted? where have i gone wrong here?
 
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raymes_k said:
if, say, an electron is stationary on Earth (ignore the probability or possibility of this for now). it, of course, is not emitting any EM radiation. However, an observer in space (stationary with reference to the sun) is looking at the electron. relative to them, the electron is accelerating (circular motion around the earth). is any EM radiation emitted? where have i gone wrong here?

I don't think you've gone wrong at all. As I understand it, photon number is not conserved in arbitrary coordinate transformations, so it's normal to see a different number of photons in accelerated and non-accelerated coordinate systems, including cases where one sees zero number of photons and the other sees non-zero numbers of photons.
 
so basically it is possible for the external observer to see photons being emitted. but then there's the question of whether these photons can be used for any constructive purpose. is this violating conservation of energy principles?
 
Why do charged particles emit light when accelerated anyways??
 
ArmoSkater87 said:
Why do charged particles emit light when accelerated anyways??

There are various applets that show what the electric field lines of an accelerating charge looks like. For instance

http://webphysics.davidson.edu/Applets/Retard/Retard_FEL.html

It's fairly easy to see from these that the electric field lines of an accelerating charge get "kinked".

The example in the above URL where you suddenly stop a moving charge exhibits this "kinking" process especially well.

The argument that the kink represents the emission of radiation is harder to follow,IMO, though it is easy to see that such a kink represents a rapidly changing electric field and hence generates a magnetic field. It's probable I'm missing some simple explanation.

The detailed explanation is given by the Lamor formula for an accelerating charge, for instance

http://farside.ph.utexas.edu/~rfitzp/teaching/jk1/lectures/node31.html
 
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Awsome sites, thanks a lot. :)
 

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