The Proportional Decay - Uncovering the Mystery

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the concept of radioactive decay, specifically the relationship between the rate of decay and the number of atoms present. Participants explore the underlying physics, mathematical representations, and implications of this relationship, addressing both theoretical and conceptual aspects.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that the rate of decay is directly proportional to the number of atoms present, following an exponential law that decreases over time.
  • Others highlight that the decay rate is commonly measured using half-life, which is the time required for half of the atoms to decay.
  • There is a question regarding the physical meaning of the statement about decay rates, prompting further clarification on the original assertion.
  • One participant explains that radioactive decay processes are random and cannot predict when a specific atom will decay, but statistical observations can be made about a population of atoms.
  • Another participant introduces a differential equation to describe the decay process, emphasizing the role of the decay constant and its relation to half-life.
  • Questions arise about why the rate of decay depends on the number of nuclei present, with some participants suggesting that the decay of any individual nucleus is random but the overall decay rate is statistical.
  • One participant discusses quantum mechanics and Fermi's Golden Rule, suggesting that the probability of decay is constant over time, leading to proportionality in decay rates across different populations of nuclei.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying degrees of understanding and agreement regarding the relationship between decay rates and the number of nuclei. While some explanations are provided, the discussion remains unresolved with multiple competing views on the underlying reasons for the observed proportionality.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the dependence on statistical interpretations and the assumptions regarding the randomness of decay events. The mathematical steps leading to the differential equation are not fully resolved, and the discussion does not reach a consensus on the foundational reasons for the decay rate's dependence on the number of nuclei.

Cheman
Messages
235
Reaction score
1
Rate of decay...

"The rate of decay is durectly proprtional to the number of atoms present, following an exponential law, the rate of decay decreasing with time" - but why is this the case?

Thanks in advance. :smile:
 
Physics news on Phys.org
As you said, the rate is proportional to the number present. This decreases with time (by decaying!). The usual measure of the decay rate is half-life, i.e. the time for half the atoms to have decayed.
 
But what does the statement actually mean in terms of physics?
 
What part of the original statement are you having trouble with?
 
Basically in nature, it has been observed that radionuclides decay primarily by beta-emission or alpha-emission, and sometimes by gamma-emission. The process is very random, in the sense that one cannot predict precisely when a given unstable atom will decay. Instead, one can take a population of the particular atom and observe that decays do occur according to a very simple first order differential equation.

dN/dt = -[tex]\lambda[/tex]N, where N is the number of particles at any given time (e.g. N= N(t)) and [tex]\lambda[/tex] is the decay constant, which is unique to that nuclide.

The decay constant [tex]\lambda[/tex] = (ln 2)/t1/2, where t1/2 is the half-life, which is the period after which approximately one-half the radioactive atoms have decayed.

Here are some useful references:

Radioactive decay - http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/nuclear/halfli.html#c1

Half-life - http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/nuclear/halfli2.html#c1

Radioactivity - http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/nuclear/radact.html#c1

http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/nuclear/radact.html#c2

http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/nuclear/beta.html#c2

Please read these and if you still have questions, we will address them.
 
But why is the first equation you mention ( dN= -lambdaNdT) true? ie - Why does the rate of decay depend on the number of nuclei present?

Thanks. :smile:
 
Whether or not any particle decays is independent of what other particles are doing. Therefore the decay rate (per unit time) is directly proportional to the number of particles still around.
 
But why is the rate of decay directly proportional to the number of nuclei present? What does the number of nuclei have to do with the rate if the decay of any particular nucleus is completely random?

Thanks. :smile:
 
It is a statistical fact. Specifically, the probability that any particle decays during a very small unit of time is fixed. Call it p. Then on average, np particles will decay (where n is the number of particles at that time) during this small interval of time. Taking the limit as the interval of time goes to 0, we end up with the simple differential equation as shown above (Astronuc).
 
  • #10
Look, I'll try and give it my best shot.
radioactive decay is a quantummechanical effect, Fermi's Golden Rule (which was found by Dirac, really) is an expression that gives the probability for a transition from undecayed to decayed nucleus. Apparently the probability for decay per unit time is independent of the time, a radioactive nucleus is equally likely to decay in say 5 minutes now than it is likely to decay in 15 minutes when it hasn't decayed 10 minutes from now.
When you have 2 kazillion nuclei, we can expect 50% (1 kazillion) of them to have decayed when one halflife has expired, if you have 4 kazillion nuclei, virtually split that up in 2x2 kazillion nuclei. Both sets of 2 kazillion will have 50% (1 kazillion) decayed nuclei, yielding 2 kazillion decayed nuclei in total, which is double that of when you started out with 2 kazillion nuclei, ater the same time of 1 halflife. Hence the direct proportionality.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
2K
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
5K
  • · Replies 17 ·
Replies
17
Views
7K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
4K
  • · Replies 20 ·
Replies
20
Views
88K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
8K