Acceleration Potential and momentum of photon.

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of acceleration potential related to photons and their momentum, particularly in the context of a test question that asked for the acceleration potential of a photon to achieve a specific wavelength. Participants explore the implications of this question, the nature of photon momentum, and the relationship between energy and momentum in the context of massless particles.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion over the test question regarding the acceleration potential of a photon, noting that their teachers were unable to clarify the concept and suggested finding kinetic energy instead.
  • Another participant explains that a photon is a one-particle state in the Fock space of the electromagnetic field, introducing the momentum-helicity basis and discussing the relationship between energy and momentum for massless particles.
  • A later reply questions whether the test question was indeed about a photon, suggesting it might have been intended for a proton, as photons do not carry charge and cannot be accelerated by an electric field.
  • One participant reflects on their understanding of acceleration potential, indicating it relates to the electric field's ability to accelerate a charged particle like a proton to achieve a specified wavelength.
  • There is a query about alternative terminology for acceleration potential, as initial searches yielded unclear results.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express uncertainty regarding the original test question's focus on photons versus protons, with some suggesting that the question may have been misinterpreted. There is no consensus on the correct interpretation of acceleration potential in relation to photons.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the distinction between massless particles like photons and massive particles like protons, particularly in terms of how they interact with electric fields and their respective momentum-energy relationships. There are unresolved assumptions regarding the definitions and implications of acceleration potential.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to students studying modern physics, particularly those exploring the properties of photons and the concepts of momentum and acceleration in electromagnetic contexts.

Smarty7
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We had a test a week ago, it asked for Acceleration Potential of an photon to achieve wavelenth of 0.005 picometer.
Not so surprisingly both of our teachers don't have a clue about what it means. While according to their solution we had to find the kinetic energy.

One more query, you have for photon
p=h/\lambda
i know how you get here with Einstein's equation E^2=(pc)^2+m^2c^4
but again when you put p=mv in momentum of photon it gives 0=h/\lambda (since m=0; mv=0) So i would like to understand what would be momentum, because for a photon again to the eistein's equation both terms are indeed (pc)^2 (since p=mc).
 
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A photon is defined as a one-particle state in the Fock space of the electromagnetic field. A possible basis is the momentum-helicity basis |\vec{p},\lambda \rangle, where \vec{p} \in \mathbb{R}^3 and \lambda \in \pm 1.

This state is an energy-eigenstate of the electromagnetic field with eigenvalue E=|\vec{p}| c.

The flaw in your thinking about energy and momentum comes from a misconception of momentum. For classical point particles (a photon is very far from being a classical point particle by the way), energy and momentum are related to the three-velocity with respect to an inertial reference frame by

E=\frac{m c^2}{\sqrt{1-\vec{v}^2/c^2}},
\vec{p} = \frac{m \vec{v}}{\sqrt{1-\vec{v}^2/c^2}}.

From this it follows the relation between energy and momentum,

E=c \sqrt{(m c)^2+\vec{p}^2},

and the three-velocity in terms of energy and momentum is obviosly given by

\vec{v}=c^2 \frac{\vec{p}}{E}.

Here, m is the invariant mass, and the equations are written for a massive particle. The limit m \rightarrow 0 is most easily understood starting from energy and momentum. The relation between energy and momentum simply becomes as written above for the photon-energy-helicity-Fock eigenstates

E=p c

and the three-velocity of a massless particle is given by

\vec{v}=c^2 \vec{p}{E} \; \Rightarrow \; |\vec{v}|=c,

i.e., independent of momentum a massless particle always runs with the speed of light, and thus the limit m \rightarrow 0 from the formulae connecting energy and momentum with the three-velocity have to be taken by fixing the energy since the Lorentz factor, \gamma=1/\sqrt{1-\vec{v}^2/c^2} diverges with m \rightarrow 0.
 
I am really sorry for the late reply, but i was only trying to understand what you had already written. Yet, i don't think i understand much of the key concepts you mentioned in here. It will take time for me to study the modern physics and then start Quantum Mechanics
 
Smarty7 said:
We had a test a week ago, it asked for Acceleration Potential of an photon to achieve wavelenth of 0.005 picometer.

Are you sure the question was about a photon and not a proton?

You can't "accelerate" photons in an electric field because (a) they don't carry charge so they're not affected by an external electric field; (b) they always travel at speed c anyway.

On the other hand, protons have charge so an electric field can accelerate them, and their speed can be anything between 0 and c.
 
jtbell said:
Are you sure the question was about a photon and not a proton?

You can't "accelerate" photons in an electric field because (a) they don't carry charge so they're not affected by an external electric field; (b) they always travel at speed c anyway.

On the other hand, protons have charge so an electric field can accelerate them, and their speed can be anything between 0 and c.
We had the word Photon in the question in our test paper, perhaps it is wrong because a similar problem one of the helpbooks had was about calculation Acceleration Potential of a proton. Thus, it can be proton.
Also, I am getting the idea of what Acceleration Potential really is, so it is the measure of electric field that can give a proton of acceleration so as to have the specified wavelength. Right? How would i arrive on the units Newtons per Coulomb then.

Is Acceleration Potential called by any other name, when i first searched for it on google. Turned out to give no meaningful results. only some unclear Wikipedia mentions.
 
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