Age of Earth: Uranium-Lead Dating, Samarium, Rubidium-Strontium

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the methods of dating the age of the Earth, specifically focusing on Uranium-Lead dating compared to other decay processes like Samarium-Neodymium and Rubidium-Strontium. Participants explore the implications of half-lives and the conditions necessary for accurate dating of geological samples.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions why Uranium-Lead dating is preferred given the longer half-lives of Samarium-Neodymium and Rubidium-Strontium, suggesting a potential inconsistency in the dating methods.
  • Another participant explains that Samarium and Neodymium are produced through radioactive decay from other elements and that their stability allows their amounts to grow over time.
  • A participant notes the importance of having detectable amounts of both parent and daughter products in rock samples for accurate dating, citing Potassium-Argon dating as an example.
  • Concerns are raised about the rarity of parent materials like Samarium affecting the reliability of Samarium-Neodymium dating, as rare parent materials may lead to insufficient decay products.
  • Another participant counters that rare earth elements are more abundant than commonly perceived, arguing that the choice of isotope should consider the half-life in relation to the age of the sample.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the effectiveness and reliability of various dating methods, particularly regarding the implications of half-lives and the abundance of parent materials. No consensus is reached on the superiority of one method over another.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight the need for detectable amounts of isotopes and the challenges posed by atmospheric exposure to certain elements, which may affect dating accuracy. The discussion also touches on the definitions and classifications of rare earth elements.

ecksor
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i am wondering if we know decays like Samarium-neodymium and Rubidium-strontium with half-lives of 106 and 49 billion years, why scientists consider the age of Earth based on Uranium-lead dating with half-life of 4.47 billion years? i mean if there wasn't Earth 100 billion years ago, where these Samarium comes from?
 
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They are produced in radioactive decay from other elements/isotopes. As they are relatively stable, their amount grows.
 
thanks
 
Read more on half life here.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Half_life

Keep in mind that it is a probability that something will decay within this time frame. See #1 paragraph in the article.
 
Also to date a rock their must be detectable amounts of both the parent and the daughter products, and you must be able to tell that the daughter products came from the parent product in the rock. Potassium/Argon dating comes to mind. Potassium is an element that can be found in quite a few minerals, especially the "K-feldspars" or potassium feldspars. K40 decays to Ca40 and Ar40. Only about 10.9% decays to argon but that is the element that geologists are interested in. The reason why is that there are usually other sources of calcium that make it very difficult to detect the calcium from radioactive decay. Argon on the other hand does not usually appear in rocks as part of the elements that make up its minerals so it is fairly safe to assume that it is a radioactive product. Potassium/Argon therefore is a very useful dating tool. You have an element that can be found in almost any rock and a daughter product that is not. The one concern is that you want material that has not been exposed to the atmosphere, since that can be a source of argon.

The main reason that I can see that samarium/neodymium is not used can be seen by what they call these elements. I know off of the top of my head that neodymium is a rare earth, and I am certain that samarium is one too. A daughter product that is rare is a good thing, that increases the odds that any daughter product you see is a result of decay, a parent material that is rare is a bad thing, that means it is highly unlikely that you will have any product to decay in the first place.
 
Rare Earth's are not that rare. There are more rare Earth's than copper, zinc or chromium. There is more samarium than tin.

You are exactly right, though, that you want to pick an isotope with a half-life close to the age of your sample. If the half-life is too short, you have mostly daughter nuclei and not many parents, and if it's too long, you have mostly parents and not many daughters.
 

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