Boeing Airbus strikes Boeing

  • Thread starter Clausius2
  • Start date

ohwilleke

Gold Member
1,445
363
Spectre32 said:
Boeing still has the whole defense side of there business that booming. All airbus has is it's commerical airliners.. .. plus lets not even get into Boeing Space stuff.
Is it? IIRC, Boeing failed to win the prime contract for either the F-22 or the F-35. There are no other fighter contracts on the horizon, and there are no serious development efforts underway for a new U.S. bomber either.

Boeing is second bannana to Lockheed Martin in the defense sector and is primarily pitching modifications for military use of the 737 (it just won a 737 based anti-submarine patrol aircraft contract) and the 747 (in cargo and tanker and anti-ballistic missile laser configurations).

I'd say Boeing is pretty much in a 7E7 or bust situation.
 
Last edited:
5
0
Boeing = pentagon queen.

Subsidies galore.
 
133
0
ohwilleke said:
Is it? IIRC, Boeing failed to win the prime contract for either the F-22 or the F-35. There are no other fighter contracts on the horizon, and there are no serious development efforts underway for a new U.S. bomber either.

Boeing is second bannana to Lockheed Martin in the defense sector and is primarily pitching modifications for military use of the 737 (it just won a 737 based anti-submarine patrol aircraft contract) and the 747 (in cargo and tanker and anti-ballistic missile laser configurations).

I'd say Boeing is pretty much in a 7E7 or bust situation.

While all of this is true... you comapred it to LM... not airbus... which is what were all talking about. In additon the the LM statements, LM was either JSF or bust. They, just have been slightly better than boeing, mainly because there operatioans are not as broad as boeings, or at lest they are not producing commcerial airplanes(Boeing already dominated them in that field a long while back). So, they have more time to and perhaps more resources to donate to these contracts. Also boeing makes <2/3 of the rockets that put sat's into orbit. Also keep LM was also the company that screwed up the conversion of those units on that mars orbitaor cause it to slam into the desert, not so long ago. I'm not really bashing LM caus ei mean christ, look at there skunk works program and what came out of that, but i'm just tossing some more fuel into the fire.... anyways BACK TO AIRBUS!
 
Last edited:

Ivan Seeking

Staff Emeritus
Science Advisor
Gold Member
7,093
173
Within five years, Boeing as we have known it will not exist.

Now where is my Kung Pow Chicken?
 

FredGarvin

Science Advisor
5,050
6
I never did hear if there was a final decision on the crash of the Airbus on takeoff from Kennedy a few years ago. The vertical stabilizer (composite) was torn off. The last I heard they were trying to blame it on pilot error.

Boeing also has a very large and lucrative rotary wing segment!
 
22
0
It is very hard admitting that USA is slowly losing civilian aircraft market.
Europeans simply make better products,that is it ! Is just the way USA makes cars, no one outside USA buys American cars.

PS.even the new presidential helicopter going to be European made Westland-Augusta.
 
Last edited:

FredGarvin

Science Advisor
5,050
6
spender said:
PS.even the new presidential helicopter going to be European made Westland-Augusta.

Wrong. Thanks for playing.

http://www.news.navy.mil/search/display.asp?story_id=16834 [Broken]
 
Last edited by a moderator:
25
0
Re :Wrong. Thanks for playing.

Hey Fred, lighten up a little huh. So the guy got his info wrong, hardly a punishable offence. This is the first forum I have ever joined because it looked like a group of serious people having adult conversations about real things.

But "Wrong, thanks for playing"

And if I can say so you seem very Pro Boeing, perhaps more than an engineer should be. This is not about Europe vs USA.

Calmest and best wishes

Ward
 

FredGarvin

Science Advisor
5,050
6
...lighten up a little huh.
I was hardly getting worked up about what was said. I think you're a bit touchy today. I was actually thinking I was being light hearted when I wrote that.

This is not about Europe vs USA.
Actually I do think this was started as a Europe vs. USA thread. However that is a mute point.

So the guy got his info wrong, hardly a punishable offence.
I have no issues with Europe vs. USA as long as both sides present factual data, which, in this thread, has been very lacking in certain poster's cases. This last one happens to be yet another example. If you don't have an issue with people spouting bogus claims then so be it. However, I prefer to call BS when I see it. Especially when the desired result is to try to take a pot shot at a person, business or country for that matter.

...you seem very Pro Boeing, perhaps more than an engineer should be.
Of course I am pro Boeing. I am an American and I flew one of their helicopters for quite a few years in the Army. I also can appreciate that company's history and what it has done. I believe a lot of comments made here on the part of the Airbus folks show a lack of respect to the engineers who came before me and have done some incredible work. It just happens to be for an American company. I would feel the same way if it were the other way around.

This is the first forum I have ever joined because it looked like a group of serious people having adult conversations about real things.
For the most part this forum is. However, I think making completely false statements for the sole basis of supporting comments like "Europeans simply make better products,that is it !" is hardly what I would call mature.

Man...I put way more into this reply than I intended.
 
25
0
Well Fred, it's obvious I touched a nerve or you would not have wasted so much space defending your position. Although I fail to see why being an American makes you pro Boeing. As an electrical engineer and also a pilot, I don't care who makes the product, nor where it comes from. Quality is paramount and both Boeing and Airbus make fine products, neither of which I would hesitate to fly in. Be happy.

Ward.
 
22
0
FredGarvin said:
Wrong. Thanks for playing.

http://www.news.navy.mil/search/display.asp?story_id=16834 [Broken]
I'm right, this is just renamed westland augusta three engines helicopter,same one Canadian search and rescue and coast guard uses.
It will be assembled in USA from some american made parts but whole helicopter was designed at the height of cold war by Europeans.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
133
0
Wardw said:
Well Fred, it's obvious I touched a nerve or you would not have wasted so much space defending your position. Although I fail to see why being an American makes you pro Boeing. As an electrical engineer and also a pilot, I don't care who makes the product, nor where it comes from. Quality is paramount and both Boeing and Airbus make fine products, neither of which I would hesitate to fly in. Be happy.

Ward.

I see were fred is comming from, I mean i rather see beoign airplanes int he sky rather than Airbus, but i do like airbus more. With boeing making the new 787 series, it will allow them to better compete int he market. Also, were protective of boeing b/c it's a massive staple in holding jobs in a wide spread area. Chicgo, Seattle, St. Louis are all areas that boeing impacts. Also, I mean were not comparing apples to apples here. Boeing makes alot of other things other than commerical airplanes, so really It's not approate to say that Airbus is making a better product. Because Airbus is so specilazied, there products should be better, than boeing. I mean thats just basic micro-economics right there. If airbus was making the rest of the AE stuff that boeing was, then we could have a better argument.
 
133
0
spender said:
I'm right, this is just renamed westland augusta three engines helicopter,same one Canadian search and rescue and coast guard uses.
It will be assembled in USA from some american made parts but whole helicopter was designed at the height of cold war by Europeans.

Excellent work, but guess who is building it.. LM... soo it's being made from a US company.. which was the whole reason everyone got all fired up. It's plain knowledge. Who cares if the euopeans designed it during the cold war. LM put there own engineering touches on it.
 
Last edited:
22
0
Spectre32 said:
LM put there own engineering touches on it.

What engineerenig touches ? installing sofa on board for GW Bush ?
 
25
0
Excellent work, but guess who is building it.. LM... soo it's being made from a US company.. which was the whole reason everyone got all fired up. It's plain knowledge. Who cares if the euopeans designed it during the cold war. LM put there own engineering touches on it.
I believe that LM are "assembling" the machine rather than building it. The fact that the donks are from GM and other systems from OEMs doesn't mean LM are "building it". LM are listed as prime contractor, not manufacturer.

I see your point though Spectre32 but in Australia for instance, I still know old soldiers from ww2 who will not buy a Japanese car, understandable, but stupid, I would buy a Japanese car over GM or Ford anyday. Why, they are just better made, (in my humble opinion, please no hate mail from the GM Ford motorheads).

Nationalism thinly desguised as patriotism is a recipe for disaster.
At the end of the day they are both making the same thing, a passenger airliner, with two wings, seats, and maybe even a pilot or 2 (at least for now).
It makes perfect sense that if one manufacturer comes up with a better way to roll the wheel, others would follow implementing it, ie FBW, composites etc, this makes the sky safer for all, could you imagine what it would be like if Airbus had tried to patent its FBW systems. And the cross polination of info from engineers sharing this type of information makes the sky even safer.

And moreso, I think that airline choose one supplier over another for a myriad of reasons, depending on the style and structure of the Airline, its routes and probably many more factors that I know nothing about. The pie is big enough for all.

:smile:
 
Last edited:

FredGarvin

Science Advisor
5,050
6
Give credit where credit is due. That is all I am saying. New kids on the engineering or pseudo-engineering block need to learn that lesson.
 
25
0
I have asked the moderators to consider putting an entry for skype usernames into the profile section.
What do people think. The possibilities are endless. It would be possible to host a chat on specific subjects at set times with one person moderating so as to avoid people speaking over each other. If we act grown up, limit the numbers in any conversation and don't get too personal, this could be an interesting way to take really interesting debates one step beyond into madness.
Does anybody remember madness.
 
22
0
Europeans are highly sucsessful in launching sattelites by Ariane rockets,leaving USA far, far behind.
As to the helicopters; US coast guard uses French Dauphins.
 
spender said:
...
I just love what Airbus is doing, for example;they produce all of their aircrafts with the same cockpit layout to minimize cross training for pilots while Boeing's jets have whole new and different cockpits,really amazing. ...
whole new and different cockpits Do you mean differnet cockpit layouts between differnent models?
 
22
0
Airbuses from small to the biggest A380 have the same cockpit layout,with some small additions for the big one,but otherwise everything looks the same and is much more easy for pilot to cross train and all that stuff.It is also kinda cool and futuristic to see Joystick operated planes(all airbuses have joystics like F-16 instead of yokes).
 
469
2
Ivan Seeking said:
Within five years, Boeing as we have known it will not exist.

Now where is my Kung Pow Chicken?
Do you mind explaining this, Ivan?
 
21
0
Boeing is never gonna stay behind in this race..and A380 might be the biggest of em all but Boeing is the king of the airplane brood.. cant question their supremacy.
The 7E7 is here!! Any match?? Its unique not only aesthetically but keeping in mind its fuel efficiency.. As they say, dont make the fuel tank bigger, rather work over the efficiency!
Wait and watch.. what boeing has in its kitty next!!
 
78
0
Airbus also has started work on similar plane to the 7e7.
 

Related Threads for: Airbus strikes Boeing

  • Posted
Replies
8
Views
5K
  • Posted
Replies
24
Views
2K
  • Posted
Replies
8
Views
14K
  • Posted
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • Posted
3 4 5
Replies
102
Views
8K
  • Posted
3 4 5
Replies
110
Views
13K
Replies
8
Views
2K
Replies
7
Views
3K

Physics Forums Values

We Value Quality
• Topics based on mainstream science
• Proper English grammar and spelling
We Value Civility
• Positive and compassionate attitudes
• Patience while debating
We Value Productivity
• Disciplined to remain on-topic
• Recognition of own weaknesses
• Solo and co-op problem solving
Top