Artifacts Have Replaced Tigers and Bears

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the role of writing and comprehension in personal and societal enlightenment. Participants explore the idea that many individuals live on "autopilot," lacking deeper understanding and engagement with knowledge. The conversation touches on the importance of reading and writing as tools for achieving comprehension and the challenges of communicating complex scientific concepts to a broader audience.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that a hierarchy of comprehension exists, with awareness at the base and understanding at the pinnacle.
  • There is a belief that many people do not read or write enough, which contributes to a lack of enlightenment and understanding in society.
  • One participant expresses a desire to develop a program aimed at helping individuals who have lived on autopilot to gain a better understanding of scientific concepts.
  • Another participant suggests that the pervasive misunderstanding of basic scientific principles is a significant issue, despite efforts from well-known figures in science communication.
  • Some participants discuss the potential of using various formats (live lectures, videos, written content) to engage people with different levels of interest and knowledge.
  • There is a shared sentiment that while many individuals can come to realizations independently, others may struggle due to social structures or lack of motivation.
  • One participant emphasizes the importance of creating a common understanding of scientific principles for the advancement and survival of humanity.
  • Several participants acknowledge the long-term nature of the projects they are discussing, indicating excitement and hope for future engagement.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the importance of writing and comprehension for personal and societal growth, but there are differing views on the effectiveness of current efforts to engage the public and the challenges involved in reaching those who are disengaged.

Contextual Notes

Some discussions reflect limitations in addressing the complexities of human behavior and societal structures that contribute to the lack of understanding. The conversation also highlights the dependence on various methods of communication to effectively reach different audiences.

Who May Find This Useful

Individuals interested in education, science communication, personal development, and societal engagement may find this discussion relevant.

coberst
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Artifacts Have Replaced Tigers and Bears

Knowing is like day breaking, understanding is like lightning striking.

Comprehension is the payoff for struggle. There is a hierarchy of comprehension. Like a pyramid with the base being awareness, followed by consciousness (awareness plus attention) then comes knowledge with understanding at the pinnacle of the pyramid.

Reading is the key to knowing and essay writing is the canvas for creating understanding.

Of all the creatures perhaps humans are the only ones who fail to live up to their potential. Obesity is the evidence of a lack of physical endeavor and boredom is the consequence of a lazy brain.

Reading is fundamental. Writing is the art and science of creation.

We can take any policy issue that might enrage anyone of us and we can discover that the root cause of it is the fact that we the citizens are not doing our job. In a liberal democracy wherein the sovereignty rests on the shoulders of the citizen any outrage committed by that society can ultimately be traced back to the lack of enlightenment by the citizen.

Enlightened does not equal informed. Information flows over us in a daily deluge but consciousness is the missing catalyst for action. Our daily dose of information might be compared to our drive to work each morning. We are deluged with information reaching our perception on our drive to work and very little of that information becomes an object of consciousness.

Humans are pattern recognition creatures. We survive by the patterns of which we are conscious. To be an enlightened citizen is to be a citizen who has rationally organized a matrix of pattern detecting systems.

We have in our genes some pattern detecting systems. When hiking in the woods I am occasionally stopped in my tracks with a deep chill by some kind of form or movement. Among this infinite of movement and pattern one particular set penetrates my consciousness. We have evolved with this detection system so as to survive the predators.

Our predators were once tigers and bears but today they are humans and artifacts (something created by humans).

I think that if we make the intellectual effort to understand some domain of knowledge and perhaps take the additional effort to write out our understanding of that matter, our essay will serve as our pattern for recognition for matters pertinent to that domain.

I consider that writing an essay is a major means for reaching an understanding of a domain of knowledge.

I think that these forums offer a great opportunity for practicing our writing skills. Do you agree? Is writing in your wallet?
 
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interesting. i would agree that the majority of people tend to fall into the day-to-day, subsistent, just-getting-by lifestyle. not enough people read. not nearly enough people write. i agree that humans haven't lived up to their potential.
 
coberst said:
Is writing in your wallet?



what do you mean? literally?
 
The sad fact is, that the people you are writing about could and would never take the time to understand your points.

This problem really bothers me, on a very fundamental level. So, I have made it one of my life's goals to develop a program that has the ability to give a level of understanding to people who have lived on autopilot their whole lives.

From the conditions that you describe, comes a massive and outrageous misunderstanding of even the most basic scientific concepts; even a misunderstanding about how we go about science! I see it every single day, even in my own family. It is insanely pervasive, despite the best efforts of those like Sagan and Dawkins.

I think it to be of almost more importance than advancing my own understanding of scientific concepts; almost though, I am still a selfish ape. :rolleyes:


Well put coberst.
 
thomasxc said:
what do you mean? literally?

I mean is writing part of your repertoire.
 
robertm said:
This problem really bothers me, on a very fundamental level. So, I have made it one of my life's goals to develop a program that has the ability to give a level of understanding to people who have lived on autopilot their whole lives.


Well put coberst.

We may be trying to do the same thing. What is this program you speak of? I am using the Internet forums to try to engage the public.
 
coberst said:
We may be trying to do the same thing. What is this program you speak of? I am using the Internet forums to try to engage the public.

It is tool that I am attempting to develop which could be used to engage any person who is literate to some degree. The end effect will be a kind of 'walk through realization' specifically about the principles behind scientific reasoning and the modes by which we go about obtaining these understandings. The format will be made so as to be flexible, i.e. live lecture, video lecture, written and illustrated, animated, voice, etc... In a manner that would allow connection to a person with no interest or previous knowledge on the subjects.

Many of us here on a physics forum come to realizations just fine on our own (with the help of literature). But I have come to find that many people are just either not capable of doing this, or simply not willing/lazy. That is why there exist such massive amounts of superstition and misunderstanding. Good people are blinded by their limiting social structures.

Once we can create at the very least a common understanding of the principles of science and reason, and the methodology, than the human race will have a much better chance of advancement and long term survival.

Not everyone must become a scientist, but if you prescribe to the products of science and reason (our modern society) than one must at least be able to appreciate the factors; or risk hindering human solidarity and quality of life.

This is a long term project of mine so don't be looking for it any time soon :smile:
 
yeah, writing is in my repertoire, though it is not generally esaays.
 
robertm

Good luck!
 
  • #10
coberst said:
robertm

Good luck!

Thank you coberst, I'll need it! :rolleyes:
 
  • #11
robertm said:
It is tool that I am attempting to develop which could be used to engage any person who is literate to some degree. The end effect will be a kind of 'walk through realization' specifically about the principles behind scientific reasoning and the modes by which we go about obtaining these understandings. The format will be made so as to be flexible, i.e. live lecture, video lecture, written and illustrated, animated, voice, etc... In a manner that would allow connection to a person with no interest or previous knowledge on the subjects.

sounds incredibly exstensive.
 
  • #12
thomasxc said:
sounds incredibly exstensive.

Yes indeed. "Long term" is the key word. But I have a basic game plan laid out as how best to proceed. I am actually very excited about attempting this. Afaik it hasn't really been done in the manner in which I am thinking before.

If I can succeed even a little bit maybe I will be able to reach just a couple more people that otherwise would have never given a damn. Just one person would make the effort not in vain.

I would encourage anyone who has the time to try something similar!
 
  • #13
robertm said:
Yes indeed. "Long term" is the key word. But I have a basic game plan laid out as how best to proceed. I am actually very excited about attempting this. Afaik it hasn't really been done in the manner in which I am thinking before.

If I can succeed even a little bit maybe I will be able to reach just a couple more people that otherwise would have never given a damn. Just one person would make the effort not in vain.

I would encourage anyone who has the time to try something similar!


Go for it!
 

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