Astronomy Major? Career Prospects & Undergrad Info

[Scourge]

Hello everyone,

I am currently a freshman undergrad physics major at Stony Brook University. However, I've been having some doubts lately. I've been taking the advanced freshman physics courses last semester and this semester, and they more challenging than I expected. I'm not failing them but these classes are basically like taking a second calculus course, its tough sometimes.

In my senior year of high school I was so sure that physics was what I wanted to do, I took AP physics, did several independent research projects with my teacher, interned with a local college physics professor, I was chosen to help represent my school at the Yale Physics Olympics, and I read several interesting theoretical physics novels. I was also very interested in astronomy. I was president of the astronomy club for 2 years, got a perfect A in the only astronomy course my high school offered, and was an amateur astronomer in my spare time using a telescope I owned.

So now since I seem to be struggling more than a physics major should be, the thought has crossed my mind multiple times that maybe I would be happier becoming an astronomer or astrophysicist instead. I've been told by my parents and a career counselor at my school that this struggling is natural being in a new environment and learning a different type of physics, but I would still like to understand life as an astronomy major/astronomer a little more. I've done some research regarding the classes I would need to take to become one and although there is still a good amount of physics and math courses, its certainly not as much as an actual physics major.

My main concern is life after my first four years of college, I know that I would need to go to grad school for any hope of a good job later on but I really don't know what the job market is like for an astronomer right now or exactly what that job would entail. I would greatly appreciate any insight PF can offer me.

 

[DivisionByZro]

How much time have you been putting into your studies? Do you take notes or read material before the class?

Nobody said physics was easy. If it was, there would be far more students in physics. There's a reason that (At my university) party kids go into psychology or the arts. (I'm not attacking psychology, be assured)

There's also a significant difference between being completely lost and finding material difficult. I'm guessing you're probably not finding the material harder than most of your peers.

 

[Scourge]

Yes I try to be the best student I can. I don't go partying ever, I've never missed a class, and I always take notes. Before every physics midterm I go to my professor's review session on the weekends. I understand your point with the difficulty of this subject and I guess I need to remind myself of that more often.

 

[eri]

There aren't all that many jobs in astronomy even with a PhD, and many astronomers actually have a PhD in physics. Astronomy and astrophysics are basically physics degrees with a few extra classes tacked on; maybe not quite as much upper level physics, astronomy PhD programs still require graduate level E&M, math, thermo, classical, and quantum mechanics. Gone are the days when you could just look at something and write down the magnitudes for a publication. Astronomers need to know the physics behind what they're doing.

 

[Scourge]

Ya I see what you're saying. I had this idea in my mind that it would be as simple as working in an observatory or something but I've heard its a lot of traveling for not a lot of pay if you even manage to find a job. I'm passionate about this subject but at the same time I don't want to be struggling for money for a good part of my life.

 

[twofish-quant]

So now since I seem to be struggling more than a physics major should be, the thought has crossed my mind multiple times that maybe I would be happier becoming an astronomer or astrophysicist instead.

About 90% of the things in astrophysics are the same as physics. So you won't find it easier.

From what I gather, what you are going through is "normal." You have a lot of smart high school students that sailed through high school, but are being challenged for the first time in college. You should know that things will only get tougher. You will need to learn to tolerate, or even *enjoy* the challenges.

I've done some research regarding the classes I would need to take to become one and although there is still a good amount of physics and math courses, its certainly not as much as an actual physics major.

This is school dependent, but it's a bad idea to take courses that are less hard, even if you can, because you'll end up hurting yourself when you get into graduate school. For a strong application, you probably should take lots of physics and math courses even if they aren't required.

My main concern is life after my first four years of college, I know that I would need to go to grad school for any hope of a good job later on but I really don't know what the job market is like for an astronomer right now or exactly what that job would entail.

The bad news is that the job market is pretty dismal for research professors. Even if you get your Ph.D., you'll have a small chance of getting a research professorship.

The good news is that if you make it through graduate school, you are smart, and you'll figure something out. If you think that you can tackle the mysteries of the universe, then figuring out "so what can I do with my Ph.D." shouldn't be that tough. This is one reason that it's a good idea for you to take hard classes. Something that keeps me going sometimes is thinking to myself "Well, I survived junior lab, this next job interview can't be worse than that."

The thing that you have to realize is that a Ph.D. in physics just doesn't work like a law or medical degree. If you get a law degree, you become a lawyer. If you get a medical degree, you become a doctor. If you get an astronomy degree, then there are too few astronomy jobs for you to be an astronomer, so at that point you have to use your smarts to figure out for yourself what you can do with your degree.

Personally, I like figuring things out for myself, so being in a situation in which I have to "do something crazy and original" is something that doesn't disturb me.

The one good thing is that I don't know anyone with an astronomy Ph.D. degree that wasn't able to figure out how to live an upper middle class life style. However, everyone ends up doing something slight different, and I can just talk about the different things that people ended up doing.

 

[twofish-quant]

I'm passionate about this subject but at the same time I don't want to be struggling for money for a good part of my life.

First of all, you have to understand that the term "passion" means suffering. The term "passion of the Christ" describes the fact that Christ loved mankind so much that he was willing to get nailed to a cross to redeem mankind. When people say that they are passionate about something, my first question is whether or not they understand what "passion" means.

One thing that you need to understand is that as a physics/astronomy major you *WILL* be making less money than if you put the same amount of effort into business or marketing. There is a reason why the US graduates over 100,000 MBA's each year and only 1000 physics Ph.D.'s. You can make more money with less effort doing something other than science, and so if you want to do science, that involves a bit of passion (i.e. suffering). How much suffering you are willing to undertake is something that you'll have to decide. For me, I was willing to put up with Ph.D. suffering, but post-doc and junior faculty level suffering was just too much for me.

If you go the academic route, you *will* be struggling for money for much of your life, but there are other things that you can do. There are a lot of astrophysicists that work for investment banks and the amount of money they make is either high or totally insane. It's also quite intellectually stimulating. One of the reasons I got into finance was that after it became obvious that the world revolved around money, I wanted to learn more about how money works.

 

[Scourge]

There are a lot of astrophysicists that work for investment banks and the amount of money they make is either high or totally insane.

Could you elaborate on this some more? I've never heard of physicists working for banks on wall street. What do they do for the banks?

 

[Scourge]

Can anyone answer this question for me? It would be greatly appreciated.

 

[khemist]

A lot of physicists are very good problem solvers and many know a programing language. They are able to make algorithms for predicting markets.