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CAC records for Obama not released yet

  1. Aug 20, 2008 #1
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2008
  2. jcsd
  3. Aug 20, 2008 #2
    Re: What has Obama to hide?

    Looks like it's the University refusing to release the papers.

    You really go out of your way to paint Obama as a bad guy, don't you?
     
  4. Aug 20, 2008 #3

    cristo

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    Re: What has Obama to hide?

    From the article: "The university's Chicago campus maintains that the donor of the records that document the work of the Chicago Annenberg Challenge has not handed over ownership rights."
     
  5. Aug 20, 2008 #4

    turbo

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    Re: What has Obama to hide?

    To the OP: You are insinuating that Obama not only has something to hide, but is complicit in covering it up. If you will read the article you linked, the University is aggressively pursuing an agreement with the person who donated the papers, so that they can release them.

    The GOP is attempting to tie Obama's tenuous connection to Ayers from 1995 to Ayer's 1960's political views, and that is pretty pathetic. It's tough to imagine how a mixed-race kid just a few years old could be tied to the Weathermen. The right-wing is playing off the ignorance of people who are gullible enough to see a "connection".
     
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2008
  6. Aug 20, 2008 #5

    Evo

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    Re: What has Obama to hide?

    I thought these were supposed to be public.

    http://www.annenberginstitute.org/challenge/pubs/researchreport/appendix.pdf

    So exactly what part of the reports would be withheld? Who is the mystery person that has stepped in and refused to release these particular papers? If there is nothing bad in them, then they should be released so as not to harm Obama, because right now they are casting doubt on him. Is Obama pushing for the release?
     
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2008
  7. Aug 20, 2008 #6

    Astronuc

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    Re: What has Obama to hide?

    Records can be donated for research, and sometimes with restrictions that they not appear in the public domain. This would be the case if someone was planning to use such records in the future, possibly for publication for profit. It appears to be nothing more than a legal matter, not something to hide.
     
  8. Aug 20, 2008 #7
    Re: What has Obama to hide?

    I don't have to go out of my way at all. Things like this pop up from time to time when Presidential elections come along.

    He (BO) puts himself in a bad light with his continued friendship with Bill Ayers. (Just as he did with his continued participation in Jerimiah Wright's congregation...listening to his racist spiritual leader and mentor/friend curse the United States.) He has not ceased to be friends with him (Ayers) and I think still serves on some meaningless board with him. He refuses to talk about Ayers in public and has not renounced him. Ayers, BTW has not shown remorse for what he did either. I believe he has even said that he didn't set off enough bombs.

    How can you ignore the relationship between a terrorist like Ayers and a Presidential candidate?








    ...and I'm sure they will eventually be released...after the election...and highly redacted.


    Obama's connection and friendship to Ayers has not ended.
     
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2008
  9. Aug 20, 2008 #8

    turbo

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    Re: What has Obama to hide?

    You just don't get it. Ayers was a radical when Obama was a young child. Obama ended up chairing a foundation with a large private endowment starting in 1995. The fact that Ayers was instrumental in creating that foundation and was instrumental in pushing educational reforms are positive things. Obama did not help Ayers make a bomb - he helped guide money from a charitable endowment into end-uses designed to improve the educational system.

    The smears are all over the right-wing blogoshere. Funny thing, though - there's no mention of the good work done by the foundation - only breathless claims that make it look like Ayers and Obama are joined at the hip.
     
  10. Aug 20, 2008 #9

    Evo

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    Re: What has Obama to hide?

    The controversy surrounding Obama's involvement with the CAC could be an issue.

    http://www.eric.ed.gov/ERICWebPorta...&ERICExtSearch_SearchType_0=no&accno=ED482425

    More background http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicago_Annenberg_Challenge
     
  11. Aug 20, 2008 #10

    Art

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    Re: What has Obama to hide?

    He probably does get it, I suspect he's just hoping others won't :rolleyes:
     
  12. Aug 20, 2008 #11
    Re: What has Obama to hide?

    Of course I get it. I get it just like Hillary got it when she answered GS in this debate record.

    Edit by Evo: removed link to inappropriate website.

    Read the last few lines of that article and you'll realize that he is the least investigated candidate ever to become America's Idol.

    You can confidently bet your last dollar that more scrutiny will follow.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 20, 2008
  13. Aug 20, 2008 #12
    Re: What has Obama to hide?

    I hope so. But I'm also hoping it's actual scrutiny, not things like "ZOMG HE'S A SECRET MUSLIM!!!", "HE WANTS TO LOSE THE WAR IN IRAQ SO HE CAN WIN THE ELECTION!!", and "HE HANGS OUT WITH TERRORISTS! HE HATES AMERICA!"

    Please, that's just pathetic.
     
  14. Aug 20, 2008 #13

    turbo

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    Re: What has Obama to hide?

    That's the level of intellectual discourse on the right-wing sites, though. They'll drum on this and paint Obama as a dear friend of an unrepentant terrorist (the currently popular theme) until the university manages to get control of the papers, and nothing untoward shows up. That won't matter to the right - they will have had days or weeks to breathlessly speculate on the contents of the papers and whip up a frenzy amongst those who view politics as a blood-sport.

    As mentioned by Astronuc, archives can be donated with some significant strings attached. I have been involved with museums that had to agree to allow material to be viewed on-site only, or only by scholars with credentials relevant to the materials, etc, etc. If a museum violates such conditions or archives the materials such that they are not available for the use(s) specified by the donor, the materials might be reclaimed by the donor. We have no idea what conditions the donor placed on this archive apart from the concern that salaries, SSI numbers, etc might be disclosed against the wishes of the donor. This will play out - it's best if the university puts the effort in high gear and releases the materials promptly.
     
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2008
  15. Aug 20, 2008 #14

    Astronuc

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    Re: What has Obama to hide?

    What controversy?

    From the http://www.eric.ed.gov/ERICWebPortal...accno=ED482425
    Education can be hit or miss. One cannot control the student population or improve their environment - homes and neighborhoods.

    According to the Wikipedia article ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicago_Annenberg_Challenge ),
    That report is available to the public.
    http://ccsr.uchicago.edu/content/publications.php?pub_id=60

    http://www.annenberginstitute.org/challenge/sites/chicago.html


    So Obama chaired the Board of Directors of a school reform effort, at which time, he was a practicing attorney.

    Chicago has always has problems with education. For that matter, every major city in the US has problems with education. It seems to be one area where both democrats and republicans fail spectacularly at the local, state and federal level - and have done so for as long as I've been in the US and probably longer.
     
  16. Aug 20, 2008 #15

    Evo

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    Re: What has Obama to hide?

    I posted that link in my first post #5.

    Did you read it? In category after category
    In other words, it was a multi-million dollar failure and Obama was on the Board of Directors.

    Just because I'm not voting for McCain (unless he makes a 180 degree turn on crtitical issues) doesn't mean I'm going to refuse to look at how successfully Obama ran programs he was in charge of. Maybe he was on the board in name only and actually had no responsibilities.

    I'd still like an explanation of the huge amount of taxpayer's money Obama gave to Pfleger's church. Was Pfleger's church really the best choice, or was it because of Pfleger's affiliation with Rev Wright and donations to Obama? These are questions worth asking.
     
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2008
  17. Aug 20, 2008 #16

    Gokul43201

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    Re: What has Obama to hide?

    The same report also says:
    If you go to the section on the Breakthrough schools, you find a table listing about a dozen metrics in which they outperformed the other schools.

    How much of that is directly his fault, and how much of the blame lies with management? How many Trillions of dollars have been spent on education programs in this country that produced nothing good?

    In fact, the report you linked even says that the conventional wisdom from literature is that there are no short term fixes to education.

    I agree. Obama definitely deserves some flack for the poor performance of the CAC.

    That's a completely unrelated question, though, isn't it? Obama earmarked $225,000 for St. Sabina programs and building repairs. That's the huge amount of money he sent to Pfleger's church. Incidentally, the things that Pfleger was spending money on included: outreach programs for prostitutes (for which he was shunned by the Catholic community), anti-drug campaigns, campaigns to reduce firearm violence and billboard drives protesting rappers that promote violence and disrespect for women.
     
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2008
  18. Aug 20, 2008 #17

    Evo

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    Re: What has Obama to hide?

    But, correct me if I am wrong, that was only for certain years, but the trend ended in almost every area in 2001. I will find that and update this, I'm on a commercial break.

    That's what I can't seem to find. How involved was he?

    Like I said, was Pfeleger's work more deserving that others? What criteria did Obama use in selecting Pfleger out of what must be many creditable charities.

    I agree, changed.
     
  19. Aug 20, 2008 #18

    Astronuc

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    Well, certainly it is a critical factor as to how Obama ran programs of which he was in charge. But is the Chairman of the Board in charge of the program, or is oversight, or is it honorary, or does the Chairman function as one who has a strategic view.

    We'd have to dig into the documents to see what the duties of the COB are.

    Most CEO's don't run the company, but the CEO and board hire the President and other managers, who do run the company on a day to day business. The CEO strategize about the future.

    Now that certainly is a legitimate question for someone running for president of the country.

    Another good question. Could it simply have been location? Of course, we now know that Pfleger's rhetoric makes some people uncomfortable.



    We don't even know what was donated or who the donor is. Does Obama know the donor? When Obama left the organization, didn't give up rights to access any records. Obama may have no control on any documents generated at the CAC. AFAIK, the program was funded by Annenberg foundation and corporation/business interests. Was taxpayer money spent on CAC?
     
  20. Aug 20, 2008 #19

    Evo

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    I don't know tax payer money was involved, but i don't see where the money for the initial grant came from.
    From the wiki article

     
  21. Aug 22, 2008 #20
    Re: What has Obama to hide?

    Evo,

    Your PM box is full.

    For my edification, what is inappropriate about the linked site?
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2008
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