Can Characteristic Functions Determine CDF Without Defined Moments?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on whether the characteristic function can be used to determine the cumulative distribution function (CDF) of a random variable when its moments are not defined. Participants explore the implications of having a random variable with undefined moments, particularly in the context of summing independent identically distributed (i.i.d.) random variables.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the distinction between moments being "not defined" versus "not known," suggesting that clarity on this point is essential for the discussion.
  • Another participant provides a specific example of a random variable with a distribution similar to the Cauchy distribution, presenting its CDF and PDF while noting challenges in evaluating an integral related to it.
  • Some participants express confusion regarding the initial question about "finding" the CDF when it is already provided, prompting a clarification about the goal of finding the CDF of the sum of multiple such random variables.
  • There is a discussion about the existence of the characteristic function even when moments do not exist, with one participant stating that the characteristic function of the sum of i.i.d. random variables can be expressed as the product of their individual characteristic functions.
  • Participants express uncertainty about whether the characteristic function provides a practical method for finding the CDF of the sum of random variables whose moments do not exist.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on whether the characteristic function can be effectively used to find the CDF in the context described. Multiple viewpoints and uncertainties remain regarding the implications of undefined moments.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight limitations related to the definitions of moments and the specific conditions under which the characteristic function can be applied. There are unresolved mathematical steps regarding the evaluation of integrals and the practical application of characteristic functions in this context.

EngWiPy
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Suppose I have a random variable whose moments are not defined, can I still use the characteristic function to find the CDF of that random variable?
 
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EngWiPy said:
Suppose I have a random variable whose moments are not defined,

Distinguish between "not defined" and "not known".

Do you have a random variable known to be from a family of distributions (e.g. Cauchy) whose moments do not exist?

-or do you have a random variable whose moments exist but are not known numerical values?
 
Stephen Tashi said:
Distinguish between "not defined" and "not known".

Do you have a random variable known to be from a family of distributions (e.g. Cauchy) whose moments do not exist?

-or do you have a random variable whose moments exist but are not known numerical values?

The random variable in question has a distribution is similar to Cauchy distribution, but not exactly the same. Its CDF and PDF are given by

F_X(x)=1-\frac{1}{1+x}\\f_X(x)=\frac{1}{(1+x)^2}

respectively, for ##0\leq x<\infty## I searched the table of integral for the integration

\int_0^{\infty}\frac{x}{(1+x)^2}\,dx

but the conditions to evaluate the integral are not met in my case.
 
Since you know the CDF, I don't understand your question in post #1 about "finding" the CDF.
 
Stephen Tashi said:
Since you know the CDF, I don't understand your question in post #1 about "finding" the CDF.

Right, I need to find the CDF of the summation of such random variables

Y=\sum_{k=1}^KX_k

where ##\{X_k\}## are i.i.d. random variables with CDF and PDF as given previously.
 
EngWiPy said:
can I still use the characteristic function to find the CDF of that random variable?

So what you mean to ask is "If I have a random variable X whose moments do not exist, can I use its characterisic function to find the CDF of Y = X1 + X2 + ...XN where each Xi is an independent realization of X?"

The characteristic function of X exists even if its moments do not. Y has a characteristic function that is the product of N copies of the characteristic function of X. Whether these facts suggest a practical way to find the CDF of Y in your specific problem, I don't know.
 
Stephen Tashi said:
So what you mean to ask is "If I have a random variable X whose moments do not exist, can I use its characterisic function to find the CDF of Y = X1 + X2 + ...XN where each Xi is an independent realization of X?"

The characteristic function of X exists even if its moments do not. Y has a characteristic function that is the product of N copies of the characteristic function of X. Whether these facts suggest a practical way to find the CDF of Y in your specific problem, I don't know.

Yes, I just want to find the CDF of the sum of the random variables, and yes it will be the product of the characteristic functions of the individual random variables because they are independent. I wanted to know if this is a valid way to find the CDF, given that the individual random variables' moments don't exist.
 

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