Could light explain dark energy?

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the potential relationship between the momentum of light and the phenomenon known as "dark energy." Participants explore whether light's energy could account for the observed acceleration in the universe's expansion, considering various contributions to energy density, including the cosmic microwave background radiation (CMBR) and light from stars.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant proposes that the momentum of light could explain dark energy, suggesting a cyclical fate for the universe if this were true.
  • Another participant counters that the energy and momentum of light contribute positively and attractively to the total energy density, which does not support the acceleration of the universe's expansion.
  • It is noted that most light energy in the universe is contained within the CMBR, which accounts for only a small fraction of the total energy density today.
  • A participant asks for specific numerical values regarding the energy density of the CMBR, leading to further discussion on estimates and calculations.
  • Participants provide various estimates for the energy density of photons and the CMBR, with references to external papers and calculations.
  • Another participant shares specific numerical values for the energy density of the CMBR and optical light, comparing them to critical density values for dark matter and dark energy.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express disagreement regarding the role of light's momentum in explaining dark energy, with some asserting that it cannot account for the observed acceleration while others explore the implications of such a hypothesis. The discussion remains unresolved with multiple competing views presented.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference various methods and sources for calculating energy densities, indicating that variations exist based on rounding and methods used. There is an acknowledgment of the complexity and uncertainty in these calculations.

FrodeM
Messages
1
Reaction score
0
Could the momentum of light explain the effect known as "dark energy"? I know the distances between galaxies are wast, but so are the surface areas of galaxies, as well as all the stars emitting the light. Would be interesting to see a calculation of the fate of the universe if this was true, perhaps gravity would pull everything together again after the stars burnt out, and we'd have a cycle of big bangs. Any thoughts?
 
Astronomy news on Phys.org
Could the momentum of light explain the effect known as "dark energy"?
No. Energy and momentum of light in the universe are well-known (because we can see it) and they are a small positive (=attractive) contribution to the total energy-density.

Please note that we don't allow wild speculations beyond actual physics here.
 
Most of the light energy in the universe is actually contained within the CMBR, and not from the light radiated by the stars! Even then, the CMBR accounts for only a tiny fraction of the total energy density of the universe today. Also, as mfb stated, this effect is well accounted for and would produce a deceleration in the expansion of the universe, not an acceleration.
 
Matterwave said:
the CMBR accounts for only a tiny fraction of the total energy density of the universe today.
Do you have a number for this?
 
the energy-density today can be calculated. Here is one method of estimating the energy-density today, though the paper calculates the energy density of photons as well as radiation

http://astro.dur.ac.uk/~csf/level1/Cosmich/lecture_7-8_notes.pdf

this paper has roughly the same energy-density for photons.

\Omega_\gamma\approx5*10^{-5}
variations occur in rounding, method used etc.

http://iopscience.iop.org/1742-6596/354/1/012009/pdf/1742-6596_354_1_012009.pdf

I've read numerous textbooks, articles etc that all have variations in the energy-density, though they are all close the the value I posted
 
Last edited:
Bill_K said:
Do you have a number for this?

Mordred provided them. :)

His number is the one I'm familiar with. If you wanted actual numbers with actual units, using ##\rho_{crit}\approx\rho_0=9\times 10^{-10}J/m^3## we get ##\rho_\gamma\approx 5\times 10^{-14}J/m^3##
 
From the cosmic energy inventory:
10-4.3 or 5*10-5 for CMB
10-5.8 or 1.5*10-6 for "optical" light, and just a bit more for non-CMB light in general
Those numbers are relative to the critical density, where dark matter has ~.23 and dark energy ~.72.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
3K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
3K
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
3K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
3K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
2K
  • · Replies 7 ·
Replies
7
Views
3K