DE 20 ty'+(t+1)y=t y(\ln{2}=1, t>0

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around solving the differential equation \( ty' + (t+1)y = t \) with the initial condition \( y(\ln{2}) = 1 \) for \( t > 0 \). Participants explore methods for rewriting the equation, finding integrating factors, and applying integration techniques.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Homework-related
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants rewrite the original equation to isolate \( y' \) and propose using an integrating factor, \( u(t) = e^{\int \frac{t+1}{t} dt} = t e^t \).
  • There is a suggestion to simplify the integrating factor before proceeding with integration.
  • One participant discusses the properties of the exponential function \( e^x \) and its significance in calculus.
  • Multiple participants provide steps for integrating the equation, including integration by parts (IBP) and applying initial conditions to find constants.
  • There are disagreements about the clarity of the simplification process and the ease of recognizing common factors in the expressions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the simplification process and the clarity of the steps involved in solving the differential equation. There are competing views on how to approach the integration and simplification.

Contextual Notes

Some steps in the integration process remain unresolved, and there are indications of missing assumptions or dependencies on the definitions of terms used in the discussion.

karush
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View attachment 9709
#20 this is the last one of the set
$ty'+(t+1)y=t \quad y(\ln{2}=1,\quad t>0$
rewrite
$y'+\left(\dfrac{t+1}{t}\right)y=1$
$u(t)=e^{\displaystyle\int\dfrac{t+1}{t}dt}=e^{t+\ln |t|}$well anyway wasn't sure about the (t+1):cool:
 
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karush said:
#20 this is the last one of the set
$ty'+(t+1)y=t \quad y(\ln{2}=1,\quad t>0$
rewrite
$y'+\left(\dfrac{t+1}{t}\right)y=1$
$u(t)=e^{\displaystyle\int\dfrac{t+1}{t}dt}=e^{t+\ln |t|}$well anyway wasn't sure about the (t+1):cool:

The integrating factor is correct, but again, simplify it so you can integrate.

$\displaystyle \mathrm{e}^{t + \ln{(t)}} = \mathrm{e}^{\ln{(t)}}\,\mathrm{e}^t = t\,\mathrm{e}^t $
 
ok is that the reason e is used so much?

Ill continue in the morning...:cool:
 
Is what the reason "e" is used so much? "e^x" has the nice property that the derivative of e^x is just e^x again! Also any exponential can be written as "e": a^x= e^{ln(a^x)}= e^{x ln(a)}.

Those are the reasons "e" is used so much.
 
Prove It said:
The integrating factor is correct, but again, simplify it so you can integrate.

$\displaystyle \mathrm{e}^{t + \ln{(t)}} = \mathrm{e}^{\ln{(t)}}\,\mathrm{e}^t = t\,\mathrm{e}^t $
#20
$\displaystyle u(t)={e}^{t + \ln{(t)}} = {e}^{\ln{(t)}}\,{e}^t = t\,{e}^t $
so
$(t\,{e}^t )ty'+(t\,{e}^t )(t+1)y=(t\,{e}^t )t$
Ok not sure way to rewrite this due to the (t+1) thot could divide by $t^2$

here are book answersView attachment 9711
 

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$ty' + (t+1) \cdot y = t$

divide every term by $t$ ...

$y' + \dfrac{t+1}{t} \cdot y = 1$

multiply every term by $te^t$ ...

$te^t \cdot y' + (t+1)e^t \cdot y = te^t$

$(te^t \cdot y)' = te^t$

$\displaystyle te^t \cdot y = \int te^t \, dt$

keep going ...
 
skeeter said:
$ty' + (t+1) \cdot y = t$
divide every term by $t$ ...
$y' + \dfrac{t+1}{t} \cdot y = 1$
multiply every term by $te^t$ ...
$te^t \cdot y' + (t+1)e^t \cdot y = te^t$
$(te^t \cdot y)' = te^t$
$\displaystyle te^t \cdot y = \int te^t \, dt$
keep going ...

IBP
$e^tt-e^t +c$
so
$ te^t \cdot y=e^tt-e^t +c$
then
$y=\dfrac{e^tt}{te^t}-\dfrac{e^t }{te^t}+\dfrac{c}{te^t}
=1-\dfrac{1}{t}+\dfrac{c}{te^t}$hopefully
 
keep going, apply the initial condition to determine $C$
 
skeeter said:
keep going, apply the initial condition to determine $C$

$y=\dfrac{e^tt}{te^t}-\dfrac{e^t }{te^t}+\dfrac{c}{te^t}
=1-\dfrac{1}{t}+\dfrac{c}{te^t}=\dfrac{(t-1+(c)e^{-t})}{t}$$y(\ln 2)=1-\dfrac{1}{\ln 2}+\dfrac{c}{2\ln 2}$
$c=2$
so the book answer is $y=\dfrac{(t-1+2e^{-t})}{t},\quad t\ne 0$
 
  • #10
karush said:
$y=\dfrac{e^tt}{te^t}-\dfrac{e^t }{te^t}+\dfrac{c}{te^t}
=1-\dfrac{1}{t}+\dfrac{c}{te^t}=\dfrac{(t-1+(c)e^{-t})}{t}$$y(\ln 2)=1-\dfrac{1}{\ln 2}+\dfrac{c}{2\ln 2}$
$c=2$
so the book answer is $y=\dfrac{(t-1+2e^{-t})}{t},\quad t\ne 0$

Come on, surely you can see several common factors that cancel. I don't know why you seem to want to keep around difficult looking terms. The reason it's called "simplifying" is because it literally makes the expressions simpler!
 
  • #11
it's not that easy to see
 

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