Discover the Fascinating Phenomenon of Northern Lights

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the causes and characteristics of the northern lights (auroras), exploring the underlying physics, including the role of solar winds, atomic collisions, and the influence of the Earth's magnetic field. Participants seek to clarify concepts related to quantum physics, energy levels, and the resulting colors of the lights.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that the northern lights are caused by electrons colliding with atoms in the atmosphere, leading to the emission of light.
  • There is discussion about how the colors of the lights are produced, with references to energy levels and the formula E=hf.
  • Some participants suggest that the color emitted depends on the energy difference between electron energy levels and the type of atom involved in the collision.
  • There are mentions of solar winds interacting with the Earth's magnetic field as a contributing factor to the phenomenon.
  • One participant questions whether the angle of light and the tilt of the Earth also play a role in the appearance of the northern lights.
  • Some participants express uncertainty about how different atmospheric conditions at various altitudes affect the collisions and resulting colors.
  • There is a mention of Birkeland currents from the sun influencing the auroras, with comparisons to similar phenomena on other planets like Jupiter and Mars.
  • One participant reflects on a misconception regarding gravity's role in the phenomenon, suggesting a combination of gravity and gas differences may affect light behavior.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the basic mechanisms behind the northern lights, such as the role of atomic collisions and solar winds, but there are multiple competing views regarding the specifics of how colors are produced and the influence of atmospheric conditions. The discussion remains unresolved on certain points, particularly regarding the effects of altitude and the role of gravity.

Contextual Notes

Some claims about the influence of atmospheric composition and altitude on the auroras are not fully substantiated, and there are unresolved questions about the exact mechanisms behind the colors emitted during the phenomenon.

gem0688
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Hi,

I have allways loved the look of the northern lights, but have never quite understood what actually causes them! :smile:

Could anyone possibly explain it to me? :confused:

Thanx
 
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Ok , i understand a bit, but i am still a bit confused.

They are caused by electrons of a certain energy which collide with atoms. Yes or no? And then how are the colours produced?

Thanx
 
gem0688 said:
They are caused by electrons of a certain energy which collide with atoms. Yes or no? And then how are the colours produced?

Have you heard about quantum physics? Light spectroscopy for example?

~H
 
yea, i did quantum physics a few years ago so a bit rusty! (all that photeletric effect and E=hf. Yea?!)
 
gem0688 said:
yea, i did quantum physics a few years ago so a bit rusty! (all that photeletric effect and E=hf. Yea?!)

Yep, the formula you gave, [itex]E = hf[/itex] is important here. Now if there are free electrons in the atmosphere, what would happen if one of these electrons were to collide inelastically with an electron of, say an oxygen atom in the atmosphere?

~H
 
Hootenanny said:
Yep, the formula you gave, [itex]E = hf[/itex] is important here. Now if there are free electrons in the atmosphere, what would happen if one of these electrons were to collide inelastically with an electron of, say an oxygen atom in the atmosphere?

~H

Ok, well in an inelastic collision part of the kinetic energy will be changed to other forms of energy and so the electron will slow down. If it was to collide with an oxygen atom, the oxygen's electrons will become excited and so realease energy as light.

Ohhh i think i am getting there now. :smile: So then the colour of light will depend on the energy, frequency (because of E=hf) and the atom it has just collided with? :confused:

Still confused though on what makes them move around?
 
gem0688 said:
the oxygen's electrons will become excited and so realease energy as light.

Almost there, they will release energy when they drop back down energy levels.

So then the colour of light will depend on the energy, frequency (because of E=hf) and the atom it has just collided with?

It will depend on the difference between the energy levels.

The aura of the northern lights is caused by the solar winds (a stream of plasma carrying ionised positve ions and electrons), they interact with the Earth's magnetic field.

~H
 
Ok, I was nearly there! :smile:

so does the colour of light emmited depend on how big the drop back down between energy levels? Does it also depend on how high the collision takes place?

So they seem to 'dance' in the sky because the Earth's magnetic field generated by the Earth's core interacts with the solar winds which pulls thems in different directions?

Thanx again
 
  • #10
gem0688 said:
so does the colour of light emmited depend on how big the drop back down between energy levels? Does it also depend on how high the collision takes place?

Yes and yes. RE the second point, I'm not sure why this happens, perhaps do to the different composition of the atmosphere at different altitudes.

gem0688 said:
So they seem to 'dance' in the sky because the Earth's magnetic field generated by the Earth's core interacts with the solar winds which pulls thems in different directions?


From thinkquest;
"As the wind is thrown thousands of kilometers out into space where it later collides with the Earth's magnetic field, it will produce a powerful force while buffeting and distorting the shape of the Earth's field. The gusts of the solar wind and the ripples they cause in the Earth's magnetic field lead to the common brightening, fading, and dancing of the northern lights. Therefore, the greater the solar wind is, the more active the lights will be."

~H
 
  • #11
Isn't the Northen also caused by how the Earth is titled and the angle of light?
 
  • #12
Hootenanny said:
Yes and yes. RE the second point, I'm not sure why this happens, perhaps do to the different composition of the atmosphere at different altitudes.

~H

Ohh ok, so it all depends with what it is colliding with at different levels. So for example, at a lower level there may more oxygen collisions compared to another part. :smile:

I think i am getting there at last! o:) :redface:
 
  • #13
scott1 said:
Isn't the Northen also caused by how the Earth is titled and the angle of light?

Would this be beacuse of the light gets split up when it hits parts of the Earth's atmosphere at different angles?
 
  • #14
gem0688 said:
Would this be beacuse of the light gets split up when it hits parts of the Earth's atmosphere at different angles?
It might but I'am not sure.
 
  • #15
gem0688 said:
Would this be beacuse of the light gets split up when it hits parts of the Earth's atmosphere at different angles?
The most "favorable" times of year is explained http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2001/ast26oct_1.htm" .

Ant http://www.atoptics.co.uk/" is cool for about every other type of atmospheric phenonenom.
 
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  • #16
Labguy said:
The most "favorable" times of year is explained http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2001/ast26oct_1.htm" .

Thanx, had a look at that site, was good. The pictures of the northern lights are really good. Also found the animation of how the magnetosphere is squashed helpful. :smile:

So it is because the electrons escape from the magnetosphere into our atmosphere, where the collisions with atoms occur. :confused:

Thanx
 
Last edited by a moderator:
  • #17
ohhh and the collisions cause energy to be released when they drop back down energy levels, which causes the colour! ;)
 
  • #18
The colour is due to the composition of gases in the atmosphere, the green yellowish hues come from the emission spectrum of oxygen where as the blues and reds are the result of the emission spectrums of Nitrogen ions.
 
  • #19
Ohh now i see, so each different gas gives off a different colour.

Thnx Schrödinger's Dog

o:) Gema o:)
 
  • #20
When I first thought about the northern lights, for some reason I was under the impression that it was gravity deflecting light relative to how a prism bends/divides light, in combination with the gas difference. Gravity of north pole deflect (c) and gas breaks light up?
Very nice display!
 
  • #21
BornLogician79 said:
When I first thought about the northern lights, for some reason I was under the impression that it was gravity deflecting light relative to how a prism bends/divides light, in combination with the gas difference. Gravity of north pole deflect (c) and gas breaks light up?
Very nice display!

The infuence from the Earth's gravitational field on light is extremely tiny.
 
  • #22
gem0688 said:
Ohh ok, so it all depends with what it is colliding with at different levels. So for example, at a lower level there may more oxygen collisions compared to another part. :smile:

I think i am getting there at last! o:) :redface:

You do have the idea. Keep in mind that it is the electrical Birkeland currents that flow from the sun to the Earth that drive the light show. As these electromagneticed fields change shapes, so do the aurora.

Jupiter and even Mars also experience similar events which are also driven by Birkeland currents.
 

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