Does an inverse Riemann exist?

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    Inverse Riemann
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of an "inverse Riemann," specifically whether it is possible to invert the traditional Riemann sum notation by placing the higher value at the bottom and the lower value at the top. Participants explore the implications of this notation in the context of summation and integration.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the existence of an "inverse Riemann," suggesting a notation where the start number is at the top and decrements to the end value at the bottom.
  • Another participant points out that switching the endpoints of an integral simply changes the sign, implying that the integral's properties remain consistent regardless of the order.
  • A participant seeks clarification on the meaning of the notation and its implications, indicating a lack of familiarity with the concept.
  • There is a distinction made between Riemann sums and integrals, with one participant emphasizing that they are similar but not the same.
  • One participant expresses confusion regarding the terminology, indicating that they are interested in the summation symbol and whether it can be inverted in a similar manner.
  • Another participant asserts that the summation symbol (∑) represents a sum and notes that they have never encountered a notation where the index is decremented from a higher value to a lower value.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the concept of an "inverse Riemann." There are competing views on the notation and its implications, particularly regarding the use of summation and integration.

Contextual Notes

Participants express varying levels of familiarity with the concepts discussed, and there are unresolved questions about the notation and its conventional use in mathematics.

smilodont
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I already googled this but I did not find a definite answer. Is there such a thing as a 'inverse riemann'? Specifically, where you invert the start number to be at the top of the riemann symbol and then decrement down to the end value which is on the bottom of the riemann symbol?
 
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Thereis nothing special about the integral you described. Switching the end points simply means changing the sign of the integral.
 
Ok, explain what you mean. I had never seen that before.
 
Do you mean ##g(x):= \int_a^x f(t)dt ## , where x is a variable?
 
smilodont said:
Ok, explain what you mean. I had never seen that before.
\int_a^bf(x)dx=-\int_b^af(x)dx
 
Smilodont: The name "Riemann" is associated with so many concepts that it would help a lot if you spelled out what you mean in some detail.
 
∑ is a riemann. You pointed out an integral. They are similar but not the same. I am talking about the riemann sum. hope that clarifies.
 
Riemann sum is used as approximation to Riemann integral. In that context what exactly is your question?
 
i am interested in the ∑ use. i was confused in calling it a riemann sum. too long since college. it's a summation symbol. what i was interested in is if you can put the higher value on the bottom and lower value on the top. If so, is that viewed as indicating you wish to decrement from the value at the top to the value at the bottom?
 
  • #10
smilodont said:
∑ is a riemann.
No, the symbol ∑ represents a sum or summation. As far as I know there is no such thing as "a riemann," short of being a reference to someone with that name.
smilodont said:
You pointed out an integral. They are similar but not the same. I am talking about the riemann sum. hope that clarifies.

A summation typically looks something like this:
$$\sum_{j = 1}^n a_j$$
The index starts at the value at the bottom and increases up through the upper value above the summation symbol. I've never seen a summation where the index was decremented, and I don't think there is any commonly used notation to indicate this.
 

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