Finding Complement of a set with respect to space U

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around finding the complement of a set with respect to a defined space, specifically in the context of geometric shapes in two and three dimensions. The original poster presents two scenarios involving a sphere and a square, questioning their understanding of the complement's definition and the relationship between the sets.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster attempts to clarify their understanding of the complement in both scenarios, raising concerns about specific points belonging to both the set and its complement.
  • Participants discuss the geometric interpretations of the sets involved, with some questioning the original poster's reasoning and suggesting that the approach to finding the complement may be flawed.
  • There are attempts to visualize the problem through sketches and comparisons of the shapes involved, such as circles and squares.

Discussion Status

Some participants provide guidance on how to approach the problem, particularly in identifying the points that belong to the complement. The conversation reflects a mix of interpretations and attempts to clarify the definitions and relationships between the sets, with no clear consensus reached on the final answers.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the complexity of the problem due to the geometric nature of the sets and the need to accurately define the complement in relation to the given spaces. There is an acknowledgment of potential confusion stemming from the original poster's interpretations and the definitions of the sets involved.

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Homework Statement



Find the complement C' of the set C with respect to the space U if:

1. U = {(x,y,z) : x^2+y^2+z^2 ≤1}, C = {(x,y,z) : x^2+y^2+z^2 = 1}
2. U = {(x,y) : |x| + |y| ≤ 2}, C = {(x,y) : x^2 + y^2 < 2}

Homework Equations



Definition of complement: The elements of the space that do not exist inside the set.

The Attempt at a Solution



I wanted to reassure myself that I am doing things right.

For 1: My answer is C' = {(x,y,z): x^2+y^2+z^2 < 1}
However, why is this right? Couldn't I have (sqrt(1/3), sqrt(1/3), sqrt(1/3)) as (x,y,z) for the set C = 1, and then have C' = (sqrt(1/3), sqrt(1/3), 0) and then we have x and y equal in both C and C' ? Is my answer wrong or what am I missing in the understanding here?

For 2: x^2+y^2 < 2 is a circle with radius sqrt(2) where as |x| + |y| ≤ 2 is a square with corners on each x = - 2, x = 2, y= - 2, y = 2. So the area i am looking for is |x| + |y| - x^2 + y^2 ≤ 2.
But I am not sure how to put this into a final answer.

I can visualize it via the area, but it's hard to put this into an answer.
 
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RJLiberator said:
and then we have x and y equal
It does not matter if x and y are equal if not also z is equal. The elements of your set are combinations of three numbers. If those numbers are not all the same, the elements are not the same.

RJLiberator said:
For 2: x^2+y^2 < 2 is a circle with radius sqrt(2) where as |x| + |y| ≤ 2 is a square with corners on each x = - 2, x = 2, y= - 2, y = 2. So the area i am looking for is |x| + |y| - x^2 + y^2 ≤ 2.
This is simply incorrect. You need to find out what points in the square are not points in the disk.
 
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Thanks for your help. For part 1, I understand now and see why I was confused. Now I understand that I have the correct answer.

For part 2, after thinking about it, I also understand why my area-area part did not work out.
It's more to say:
(|x|+|y| ≤ 2) - (x^2+y^2 < 2) = the complement, but that's not a good answer. I need to find the points in the square that are not points in the disk as you stated.

I see that |x|+|y| = 2 is definitely in the complement.

What I am thinking here is

Answer: C' = {(x,y): sqrt(2) ≤ |x|+|y| ≤ 2}

This takes out the middle part and leaves the good ends. However, their seems to be an error in that sqrt(2) is just another square, but we want a circle.
 
Hint: You can put several conditions into the definition of the set.
 
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RJLiberator said:
For 2: x^2+y^2 < 2 is a circle with radius sqrt(2) where as |x| + |y| ≤ 2 is a square with corners on each x = - 2, x = 2, y= - 2, y = 2. So the area i am looking for is |x| + |y| - x^2 + y^2 ≤ 2.

Orodruin said:
This is simply incorrect. You need to find out what points in the square are not points in the disk.
@RJLiberator, if you haven't already done so, sketch a graph of the two sets. If you have done this, then disregard this advice.
 
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Hm. I think I was making this harder then I needed to make it:

C' = {(x,y) : x^2+y^2 ≥ 2 and |x|+|y| ≤ 2 } This seems to get the correct area.
 

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