How do I make water fizzy without carbonation?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the possibility of making water fizzy without using carbonation, exploring alternative gases that could be added to water to create bubbles while potentially affecting its pH. Participants consider the implications of different gases on water's acidity and alkalinity, as well as their solubility and safety.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that a non-toxic gas could be added to water to create bubbles and increase its pH to around 7.2.
  • Another participant provides resources on gas solubility in water, noting that many soluble gases are not compatible with life.
  • There is a discussion about how carbon dioxide affects pH when dissolved in water, with one participant questioning the relationship between gases and pH.
  • Some participants discuss the role of nitrogen as a gas that can "carbonate" drinks without making the water more acidic, while also noting it does not increase alkalinity.
  • There are inquiries about the ionization of water and how it relates to pH, with some participants seeking clarification on the relationship between chemical formulas and their pH levels.
  • One participant mentions sulfur hexafluoride and xenon as gases with low solubility in water, while also noting the environmental concerns with some chlorofluorocarbons.
  • Another participant raises the idea of using baking soda to neutralize acidity, although they express uncertainty about its flavor impact.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express various viewpoints on the gases that could be used to create fizz in water, with no consensus on a specific solution. There are ongoing questions about the effects of different gases on pH and the understanding of ionization in water.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight limitations in understanding the relationship between gas solubility, pH, and the properties of substances when dissolved in water. There are unresolved questions about how to accurately determine the pH of solutions based on their components.

LightningInAJar
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I have had seltzer water which is merely carbonated water which is more acidic hence a more sour flavor as shown in link below. Is there a non-toxic gas that can be added to water to give it bubbles that actually makes it more alkaline? And if so, perhaps combining it with carbonation so the PH is something like 7.2 and tastes like normal water?

https://www.mcgill.ca/oss/article/h...ge for all cold, carbonated water's pH is 4.5.

https://www.watercare.com/about-us/...n acidic pH changes many,pH level more than 7).
 
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Chemistry news on Phys.org
A short list of gas solubility in water is at:
https://www.wiredchemist.com/chemistry/data/solubilities-gases

Unfortunately, the higher solubility gases on the list are not compatible with life.

If you want a longer list, look here for 7 pages worth:
https://hbcp.chemnetbase.com/faces/documents/05_30/05_30_0001.xhtml

Or if you have access to the CRC HANDBOOK OF CHEMISTRY and PHYSICS
check the Index for: Gases, solubility on water.

(above found with:
https://www.google.com/search?&q=solubility+of+gasses+in+water)

Cheers,
Tom
 
Carbon dioxide has no PH because it's a gas? How is it known how a gas effects PH of water when desolved?
 
LightningInAJar said:
Carbon dioxide has no PH because it's a gas? How is it known how a gas effects PH of water when desolved?
When CO2 is dissolved in water, some of it combines with water molecules to make a carbonic acid:
CO2 + H2O --> H2CO3
In water CO2 is very involved with pH.
This in important in biology as well as water quality for fish.
 
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I want more OH than H ions? I assume the above includes 2 H and zero OH?
 
BillTre said:
Do you understand ionization in water?
Here is a review of pH for you.
Do you by chance have a table of chemical formulas and their respective PH level so I can visualize it better?
 
I think baking soda can be used to neutralize acid, but not sure if it adds flavor.
 
LightningInAJar said:
Do you by chance have a table of chemical formulas and their respective PH level so I can visualize it better?
pH is a property of a aqueous solution. The pH of a "chemical formula" doesn't make sense, it is a function of the concentration of a given solute.
 
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  • #10
Sulfur hexafluoride is one non-toxic gas, but it seems to have too low water solubility for this purpose. Xenon gas is more water-soluble than other noble gases, but I'm not sure how much more of it can be dissolved in water with reasonable pressurization. It is also expensive and has a general anesthetic effect if inhaled in large amounts.

Some gaseous chlorofluorocarbons are likely to be water soluble, but they harm the ozone layer.
 
  • #11
Nitrogen is used to "carbonate" drinks without using CO2 carbonation.
Using CO2 makes the water it is dissolved in more acidic. Nitrogen (N2) does not do this, so it doesn't make the water more acidic, but it doesn't make the water more alkaline either. No effect on the pH since it doesn't ionize.

This has been used in several beverage products and has produced flavorful effects:
In soft drinks, sparkling water, beer, wine, juice drinks, tea, flavored water, sports drinks and many other carbonated and non-carbonated beverages, nitrogen provides unique functionality to reduce foaming, protect flavors, retain desired colors, and maintain the integrity of your product.
 
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  • #12
DrClaude said:
pH is a property of a aqueous solution. The pH of a "chemical formula" doesn't make sense, it is a function of the concentration of a given solute.
So I wouldn't be able to look at a formula for a substance and calculate how acidic it is?
 
  • #13
LightningInAJar said:
So I wouldn't be able to look at a formula for a substance and calculate how acidic it is?
You need the properties of the substance when dissolved in water. The substance alone will not be very informative.

You also don't seem to have a very good understanding of the interrelationships between pH, water, and ionized compounds. This will make the success of any calculations you try hit or miss.
Without understanding, mistakes are more likely.
 
  • #14
BillTre said:
Nitrogen is used to "carbonate" drinks without using CO2 carbonation.
Using CO2 makes the water it is dissolved in more acidic. Nitrogen (N2) does not do this, so it doesn't make the water more acidic, but it doesn't make the water more alkaline either. No effect on the pH since it doesn't ionize.

This has been used in several beverage products and has produced flavorful effects:
Strange that I hadn't heard about that before...
 
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  • #16
Hmm. No easy task I guess.