How fringe are alternatives to the Big Bang Theory?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the status of the Big Bang Theory (BBT) as the prevailing cosmological model and the nature of alternative theories. Participants explore the implications of BBT, the validity of competing models, and the sociological aspects of acceptance within the scientific community.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that BBT is the standard theory explaining the universe's origin, while others challenge the clarity of what BBT entails, particularly regarding the initial moments after the big bang.
  • There is a consensus among some that the BBT is well-established up to approximately 10^-30 seconds after the big bang, but uncertainty remains about events prior to that time.
  • Some participants suggest that alternative theories proposing different scenarios for the universe's early moments are considered fringe or lacking in serious support.
  • Concerns are raised about the implications of BBT suggesting a 'creation' event, with some arguing that this does not necessarily imply an intelligent creator.
  • One participant describes the beginning of the universe as a "mathematical nonsense" that cannot accurately describe reality, indicating a critical view of BBT's foundational assumptions.
  • There is a suggestion that understanding the early universe is contingent upon developing a working theory of quantum gravity, with differing opinions on the feasibility of this understanding in the near future.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a mix of agreement and disagreement. While some agree on the established nature of BBT up to a certain point, others highlight significant uncertainties and differing interpretations regarding the early universe and the implications of BBT.

Contextual Notes

Participants note limitations in understanding the early universe due to the lack of a working theory of quantum gravity and the unresolved nature of events prior to 10^-30 seconds after the big bang.

Mooky
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To my understanding, The Big Bang Theory (BBT) is considered the standard, mainstream theory explaining the origin of the universe. I know that there are alternative theories, and my question is, how discredited, fringe, or false are these theories considered, if at all? Alternatively, how secure is BBT's position as the mainstream, standard theory? Are proponents of other theories considered nuts, outdated, or mainstream? How many physicists are out there who think BBT is either completely wrong or in need of some serious modifications?

This is really more of a sociological question than a scientific one. I'm not looking to debate BBT or its alternatives, as I'm unqualified to do so.
 
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To understand (or ask) this question, it is first necessary to clarify what is meant by the BBT. Scientists typically mean by this that the universe was hotter and more dense in the past, and we can explain the story up to ~10^-30s after the big bang (whatever that means). I don't think any serious cosmologist would disagree with this picture, and I think the last major opposition to this was the Steady State theory which died in the 60's with the discovery of the cosmic microwave backround radiation. So in this sense, the BBT is quite iron clad.

As far as what happened before that 10^-30s, and what the 'big bang' actually means, the jury is definitely still out on that one. Certain ideas might seem more wacky than others, but as far as I know there have been few testable predictions from that regime, so it's hard to make any kind of selection between any models.
 
OK, thanks for the explanation. From your answer I gather that theories that hypothesize different scenarios for what happened after the first 10-30 seconds are very much fringe.
 
Yes. As said, essentially no serious cosmologist has much doubt about that.
 
BBT generates discomfort because it implies a 'creation' event.
 
Chronos said:
BBT generates discomfort because it implies a 'creation' event.

'creation event' generates discomfort because it implies an intelligently deliberate creator, but it really does not imply that at all. Creation event just means that point from which we measure 10^-30 secs from. It does imply some sort of cause though but it's not something we can ever know anything about.

As well as the CMBr it was the discovery that the universe looks very different the farther back we look in time, which is not what the SST predicts. We don't see quasars in the local cluster of galaxies.
 
Mooky said:
To my understanding, The Big Bang Theory (BBT) is considered the standard, mainstream theory explaining the origin of the universe.
This isn't correct. The big bang theory describes how the universe has changed over time. While there is a beginning in the theory, that beginning is mathematical nonsense that cannot possibly describe reality.

Here's a really good essay on what the BBT is, and what the evidence for it is:
http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/astronomy/bigbang.html
 
Chalnoth said:
This isn't correct. The big bang theory describes how the universe has changed over time. While there is a beginning in the theory, that beginning is mathematical nonsense that cannot possibly describe reality.

Here's a really good essay on what the BBT is, and what the evidence for it is:
http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/astronomy/bigbang.html

Thanks for clarifying. If I understand correctly, this is a restatement of the fact that it's unclear what happened in the first 10-30 seconds, but the rest of the story is quite well-established.

Thank you all for your answers.
 
Mooky said:
Thanks for clarifying. If I understand correctly, this is a restatement of the fact that it's unclear what happened in the first 10-30 seconds, but the rest of the story is quite well-established.
This is largely correct. However, it is becoming more clear all the time what happened in that first fraction of a second.
 
  • #10
Until we have a working theory of quantum gravity, understanding the very early universe is beyond our grasp.
 
  • #11
Chronos said:
Until we have a working theory of quantum gravity, understanding the very early universe is beyond our grasp.
Maybe. Not necessarily. It all depends upon the details.
 
  • #12
YummyFur said:
... It does imply some sort of cause though but it's not something we can ever know anything about.

I find it quite amazing that you can predict what science will or will not be capable of the day after tomorrow.
 

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