How to Solve Inhomogeneous Differential Equations via Expansion?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around solving an inhomogeneous differential equation of the form \(y'' + k^2y = \phi(x)\) with specified homogeneous boundary conditions. Participants explore methods of expansion using eigenfunctions, particularly focusing on the roles of Green's functions and Fourier analysis in deriving solutions.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests expanding \(y(x)\) and \(\phi(x)\) in terms of eigenfunctions of the operator \(L = \frac{d^2}{dx^2}\) to solve the differential equation.
  • Another participant outlines steps to find eigenfunctions and substitute them into the definitions of \(y\) and \(\phi\), followed by plugging these into the differential equation.
  • Several participants discuss the form of the Green's function and its relation to the solution, with one proposing that \(G(x, x')\) can be expressed in terms of the eigenfunctions.
  • There is a suggestion that the coefficients \(a_n\) and \(b_n\) can be determined using relationships derived from the differential equation.
  • One participant argues that Green's functions may be unnecessary and proposes using Fourier analysis instead, providing formulas for \(b_p\) and \(a_p\).
  • Another participant raises a concern about the orthogonality of eigenfunctions when \(k = k_m\) and questions the implications for the solution.
  • A later reply provides a detailed analysis of the relationships between the coefficients and the eigenfunctions, leading to a proposed exact solution without the need for Green's functions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the necessity of Green's functions versus Fourier analysis for solving the problem. While some advocate for the use of Green's functions, others believe that Fourier analysis suffices. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the best approach to take.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the completeness of the eigenfunctions and the orthogonality conditions play significant roles in the analysis, but there are unresolved questions about the implications of these properties for specific cases of \(k\).

Dustinsfl
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Solve inhomogeneous differential equation
\[
y'' + k^2y = \phi(x)
\]
with homogeneous boundary conditions \(y(\ell) = 0\) and \(y(0) = 0\) by expanding \(y(x)\) and \(\phi(x)\)
\begin{align*}
y(x) &= \sum_na_nu_n(x)\\
\phi(x) &= \sum_nb_nu_n(x)
\end{align*}
in the eigenfunctions of \(L = \frac{d^2}{dx^2}\) where \(Lu_n(x) = -k^2u_n(x)\) and \(u_n\) satisfies the homogeneous boundary conditions.

How am I supposed to use the definitions of \(y(x)\) and \(\phi(x)\) to solve this problem?
 
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Re: inhomogeneous DE via expansion

I would do this in the following steps:

1. First, find the eigenfunctions of the indicated operator.

2. Plug those eigenfunctions into the definitions of $y$ and $\phi$.

3. Plug those definitions into the DE and see what you can find out.
 
Re: inhomogeneous DE via expansion

Ackbach said:
I would do this in the following steps:

1. First, find the eigenfunctions of the indicated operator.

2. Plug those eigenfunctions into the definitions of $y$ and $\phi$.

3. Plug those definitions into the DE and see what you can find out.
Let \(G(x, x') = \delta(x - x')\) is a solution with B.C. \(G(0, x') = G(\ell, x') = 0\).
\[
u(x) = u_n(x) + \int_0^{\ell}G(x,x')\phi(x')dx'
\]
where \(Lu_n(x) = \frac{d^2}{dx^2}u_n + k^2u_n = 0\).
Now for the steady state, we have
\[
\left(\frac{d^2}{dx^2} + k^2\right)u_n = 0
\]
So \(u_n(x) \sim \left\{\cos(kx), \sin(kx)\right\}\).
From the B.C., \(u_n(x)\sim B_n\sin\left(\frac{\pi n}{\ell}x\right)\).
\begin{align}
G(x, x') &= \sum_{n = 1}^{\infty}B_n\sin\left(\frac{\pi n}{\ell}x\right)\\
y(x) &= \sum_{n = 1}^{\infty} a_n\sin\left(\frac{\pi n}{\ell}x\right)\\
\phi(x) &= \sum_{n = 1}^{\infty} b_n\sin\left(\frac{\pi n}{\ell}x\right)
\end{align}
Should they all be the same? I know how to find the coefficients for \(G(x, x')\) but what about for \(y(x)\) and \(\phi(x)\)?
 
Re: inhomogeneous DE via expansion

So now, plugging your stuff into the DE, we have
$$-\sum_{n = 1}^{\infty} a_n \left( \frac{\pi n}{\ell}\right)^{2}\sin\left(\frac{\pi n}{\ell}x\right)+k^{2}\sum_{n = 1}^{\infty} a_n \sin\left(\frac{\pi n}{\ell}x\right)=\sum_{n = 1}^{\infty} b_n\sin\left(\frac{\pi n}{\ell}x\right).$$
Presumably the $b_{n}$'s are known, and the $a_{n}$'s are not. Can you think of a way to determine the $a_{n}$'s?
 
Re: inhomogeneous DE via expansion

Ackbach said:
So now, plugging your stuff into the DE, we have
$$-\sum_{n = 1}^{\infty} a_n \left( \frac{\pi n}{\ell}\right)^{2}\sin\left(\frac{\pi n}{\ell}x\right)+k^{2}\sum_{n = 1}^{\infty} a_n \sin\left(\frac{\pi n}{\ell}x\right)=\sum_{n = 1}^{\infty} b_n\sin\left(\frac{\pi n}{\ell}x\right).$$
Presumably the $b_{n}$'s are known, and the $a_{n}$'s are not. Can you think of a way to determine the $a_{n}$'s?

I was reading that the superposition of eigenfunctions: Green's functions and it says that
\[
Ly_n(x) = \lambda_n\rho(x)y_n(x)
\]
where \(\rho(x)\) is a weighting function. So does that mean I can write \(b_n = \frac{2}{\ell}\)?
Also, would it follow by the completeness of Hermitian eigenfunctions?
\[
a_n = \frac{b_n}{k^2 - k_n^2}
\]

If we do that, we get
\begin{align}
\sum_{n = 1}^{\infty}a_n[k^2 - k_n^2]\sin(k_nx) &= \frac{2}{\ell}\sum_{n = 1}^{\infty}\sin(k_nx)\\
a_n[k^2 - k_n^2]\int_0^{\ell} \sin^2(k_nx)dx &= \frac{2}{\ell}\int_0^{\ell} \sin^2(k_nx)dx\\
a_n &= \frac{2}{\ell(k^2 - k_n^2)}
\end{align}
If that is \(a_n\) and \(b_n\) is \(2/\ell\), \(y(x)\) is a solution with that given \(\phi(x)\).
 
Last edited:
Re: inhomogeneous DE via expansion

I think Green's functions are overkill for this problem. Just use Fourier analysis. I get that
$$b_{p}= \frac{2}{\ell} \int_{0}^{ \ell} \sin \left( \frac{\pi p x}{ \ell} \right) \phi(x) \, dx,\quad
\text{and} \quad
a_{p}= \left( \frac{ \ell^{2}}{k^{2} \ell^{2}- \pi^{2} p^{2}} \right) \, b_{p}.$$
 
Re: inhomogeneous DE via expansion

Ackbach said:
I think Green's functions are overkill for this problem. Just use Fourier analysis. I get that
$$b_{p}= \frac{2}{\ell} \int_{0}^{ \ell} \sin \left( \frac{\pi p x}{ \ell} \right) \phi(x) \, dx,\quad
\text{and} \quad
a_{p}= \left( \frac{ \ell^{2}}{k^{2} \ell^{2}- \pi^{2} p^{2}} \right) \, b_{p}.$$

I think I have to use Green's function since I need an exact solution but I have gotten that.

However, if \(k = k_m\), why would \(u_m(x)\) have to be orthogonal to \(\phi(x)\). For the case \(k_m = k_n\), the LHS is always zero.
\[
\sum_na_n[k_m^2 - k_n^2]\sin(k_nx) = \frac{2}{\ell}\sum_n\sin(k_nx)
\]
Therefore, in order \(\int_0^{\ell}u_m(x)\phi(x)dx = 0\), they must be orthgonal. When \(k_m\neq k_n\), I don't see why that would be the case.
 
Re: inhomogeneous DE via expansion

dwsmith said:
I think I have to use Green's function since I need an exact solution but I have gotten that.

However, if \(k = k_m\), why would \(u_m(x)\) have to be orthogonal to \(\phi(x)\). For the case \(k_m = k_n\), the LHS is always zero.
\[
\sum_na_n[k_m^2 - k_n^2]\sin(k_nx) = \frac{2}{\ell}\sum_n\sin(k_nx)
\]
Therefore, in order \(\int_0^{\ell}u_m(x)\phi(x)dx = 0\), they must be orthgonal. When \(k_m\neq k_n\), I don't see why that would be the case.

Hmm. Well, here's my analysis. First, we write $\phi$ in terms of the eigenfunctions:
\begin{align*}
\phi(x)&= \sum_{n=1}^{ \infty}b_{n} \sin( \pi n x / \ell) \\
\int_{0}^{ \ell} \sin( \pi m x / \ell) \, \phi(x) \, dx&= \sum_{n=1}^{ \infty} \left[b_{n} \int_{0}^{ \ell} \sin( \pi n x / \ell) \sin( \pi m x / \ell) \, dx\right] \\
\int_{0}^{ \ell} \sin( \pi m x / \ell) \, \phi(x) \, dx&= \sum_{n=1}^{ \infty} \left[b_{n} \delta_{nm} (\ell/2) \right] = b_{m} (\ell/2).
\end{align*}
Therefore,
$$b_{m}= \frac{2}{ \ell}\int_{0}^{ \ell} \sin( \pi m x / \ell) \, \phi(x) \, dx.$$
Now, from the equation I wrote down in the previous post, we have that
$$\sum_{j=1}^{ \infty} \left[ (k^{2}-( \pi j / \ell)^{2}) \, a_{j} \sin( \pi j x / \ell) \right]= \sum_{p=1}^{ \infty} b_{p} \sin( \pi p x / \ell).$$
Multiplying through by $\sin( \pi m x / \ell)$ and integrating from $0$ to $\ell$ yields
$$\sum_{j=1}^{ \infty} \left[ (k^{2}- \pi^{2} j^{2}/ \ell^{2}) \, a_{j} \, \delta_{mj} \, ( \ell/2) \right]= \sum_{p=1}^{ \infty} b_{p} \delta_{mp}( \ell/2),$$
and collapsing both sums due to the Kronecker Deltas yields
$$a_{m}= \left( \frac{ \ell^{2}}{k^{2} \ell^{2}- \pi^{2} m^{2}} \right) \, b_{m}.$$
Therefore, the final solution in all its glory is
\begin{align*}
y(x)&= \sum_{m=1}^{ \infty} \left[
\frac{ \ell^{2}}{k^{2} \ell^{2}- \pi^{2}m^{2}} \cdot \frac{2}{ \ell} \cdot \int_{0}^{ \ell} \sin( \pi m \xi/ \ell) \, \phi( \xi) \, d \xi \cdot \sin( \pi m x/ \ell) \right] \\
&=\sum_{m=1}^{ \infty} \left[
\frac{ 2 \ell}{k^{2} \ell^{2}- \pi^{2}m^{2}} \cdot \int_{0}^{ \ell} \sin( \pi m \xi/ \ell) \, \phi( \xi) \, d \xi \cdot \sin( \pi m x/ \ell) \right].
\end{align*}
It's an exact solution (assuming I've done everything correctly), with no Green's functions required.

If you want to use Green's functions, go ahead. Alas, I know only the very basics of the theory, so I cannot follow you there. But this method of solution is fairly straight-forward, involving nothing more complicated than Fourier analysis.
 

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