I'm not sure I understand the problem, can someone clarify?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around a problem involving Morse code symbols represented by sequences of dots and dashes. Participants explore how many different symbols can be formed using sequences of seven or fewer dots and dashes, considering the implications of combinations versus permutations.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion about the problem and suggests it may involve combinations, using a combinations formula to calculate the number of symbols.
  • Another participant argues that the problem requires considering permutations instead, as different symbols can correspond to different sequences.
  • A subsequent reply supports the permutation approach but arrives at a different numerical conclusion, suggesting 42 symbols.
  • Another participant challenges the use of permutations and combinations, proposing that the problem is about counting strings of varying lengths made from two symbols.
  • One participant suggests using the formula 2^n to calculate the total number of strings, leading to a calculation of 128 for n=7.
  • Another participant corrects the string length calculation and proposes a summation of powers of 2 to arrive at 254 as the total number of different symbols.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the correct approach to the problem, with multiple competing views on whether to use combinations, permutations, or a direct counting method based on string lengths.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved assumptions regarding the interpretation of the problem, particularly whether order matters and how to handle repetitions of symbols. The calculations presented vary significantly based on the chosen method.

mr_coffee
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Hello everyone. I'm not sure where to begin with this problem because I don't think I know what they are trying to tell me.

Heres what it says:

In morse code, Symobls are represented by variable-length sequences of dots and dashes. For example, A = .-, 1 = . - - - -, ? = . . - - . .
How many different symobls can be represented by sequences of seven or fewwer dots and dashes?

So are they saying, I have a total number of 7 either dots or dashes to work with and how many different permutations can i get with that? or how many different combinations can i get with that?

Order shouldn't matter, they didn't say it did, and also repeitions not allowed because you don't want 2, A's, ?'s, etc.

So that leaves me to think its combinations.

Would this be correct?

combinations formula is the following:
Choosing r items from n possibilities:
n!/[r! (n-r)!]

so your choose 2 items from 7 possibilities
r = 2
n = 7

7!/[2!5!] = 21 different symbols can be represeented by sequences of seven or fewer dots and dashes.
 
Last edited:
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You are looking for sequences of Seven or fewer, so you are not done yet. I think you will have to compute 7 cases, but once you see the pattern the number for each case should be easy to find. Also, I would say you are looking at permutations, not combinations, since we can map different symbols to .- and -.

If this is the case, what would the number be?
 
hm...if its permutations then it should be pretty straight forward using:
P(n,r) = n!/(n-r)!
That means order does matter, so
n = 7
r = 2
7!/(5)! = 42 different symbols which sounds more correct than 21.
 
42 symbols? That doesn't sound remotely correct. Why are you doing it with permutations or combinations? It is just asking how many strings of length 1,2,3,4,5,6, or 7 can be made up from 2 symbols, be they dots, dashes, or zeroes and ones. You are off by a factor of around 5.5.
 
matt, I'm not sure i understand how your supose to figure this out. All the problems I've been doing invovle permutations or combinations that's why I thought that's how it would be solved.
WHen you say strings of length 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, and 7, could i do it directly and say:
1 = . or -
2 = .- or .-
3 = .-. or -.. or ..- or --- or ...
4 = 4!
5 = 5!
6 = 6!
7 = 7!

but I'm getting huge numbers, I'm not sure i follow

or is it just

2^n? 2^7 = 128
 
Last edited:
You've not counted strings of length 2 correctly.
 
(2^7)+(2^6)+(2^5)+(2^4)+(2^3)+(2^2)+(2^1)= 2^8-2 = 254

hows that look?
 
That looks perfect.
 
Thanks matt!
 

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