Introducing Set Theory: Proving Real #s Identical in Bases

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SUMMARY

This discussion focuses on set theory, specifically the equivalence of real numbers across different bases. It establishes that 1/1 = 2/2 = 1 and emphasizes the importance of bijections when mapping natural numbers to rational numbers. The conversation highlights that while numbers themselves are base-independent, their representations in various bases can complicate proofs, particularly with infinite representations and irrational numbers. The participants conclude that while a clean proof may be elusive, defining mappings between real numbers and their base representations is essential.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of set theory concepts such as bijections, injections, and surjections.
  • Familiarity with rational and real numbers, including their properties.
  • Knowledge of number bases and how real numbers are represented in different bases.
  • Basic grasp of infinite series and limits, particularly in relation to decimal representations.
NEXT STEPS
  • Research the concept of bijections in set theory and their implications for mapping sets.
  • Explore the properties of rational and irrational numbers, particularly in relation to base representations.
  • Study the implications of infinite decimal representations, such as 0.999... = 1.
  • Learn about the Cantor-Bernstein-Schröder theorem and its relevance to set equivalence.
USEFUL FOR

Mathematicians, students of mathematics, and anyone interested in set theory and the properties of numbers across different bases will benefit from this discussion.

Blackberg
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I'm introducing myself to set theory. My reference doesn't seem to address the fact that 1/1 = 2/2 = 1. If we make a correspondence between natural numbers and rational numbers using sequential fractions, should we just skip equivalent fractions so as to make it a bijection? In other words, does it matter whether the correspondance is injective or not, or whether it is surjective or not?

I'm also wondering how one would prove that the set of real numbers in base ten is identical to the set of real numbers in another base.
 
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If you want to make a bijection it is important. If you just want to show there are not more rational than natural numbers, it does not matter.
The reverse statement (there are not more natural than rational numbers) is trivial anyway.

Blackberg said:
I'm also wondering how one would prove that the set of real numbers in base ten is identical to the set of real numbers in another base.
Numbers do not have a base. You can express a real number in a specific base to write it down, but the number itself is independent of it.
 
If you are looking for a simple, clean proof, I don't think there is one. It could be done, but it might be a lot of work. You can define the mapping between the real numbers and their representation in any base. Composing the mappings should give you a mapping between the two representations. There might be a lot of tedious complications with infinite length representations like 1 = 0.9999999...are two base 10 representations of 1. Irrational numbers are another complication.
 
If there are an infinite number of natural numbers, and an infinite number of fractions in between any two natural numbers, and an infinite number of fractions in between any two of those fractions, and an infinite number of fractions in between any two of those fractions, and an infinite number of fractions in between any two of those fractions, and... then that must mean that there are not only infinite infinities, but an infinite number of those infinities. and an infinite number of those...

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