Is the Mass of an Atom Equivalent to Its Energy?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the relationship between mass and energy at the atomic level, exploring whether the mass of an atom is equivalent to its energy. Participants examine concepts related to atomic motion, the behavior of particles like electrons and photons, and the implications of energy loss on mass. The scope includes theoretical considerations and speculative ideas about the nature of particles and energy transfer.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that if mass is equivalent to energy, then the mass of an object could be considered as the energy due to the motion of its atoms.
  • Others argue that a particle at rest would not have zero mass, even if it had zero kinetic energy.
  • There is a suggestion that if energy is removed from a system, such as through photon emission, the mass of the system decreases, raising questions about the nature of mass and energy.
  • Some participants express uncertainty about how mass can decrease if energy and mass are equivalent, questioning whether mass is indeed energy.
  • One viewpoint suggests that everything may be fundamentally composed of photons, with varying degrees of energy and mass associated with different particles.
  • Another participant mentions that photons, while often considered massless, may have properties that complicate their relationship with mass and energy.
  • There is a discussion about the implications of energy transfer and the role of photons in processes like heat transfer and electromagnetic interactions.
  • Some participants speculate on the idea that the mass of a photon could depend on its frequency, linking it to the momentum of the photon.
  • A later reply questions the assumption that photons must have mass for energy transfer to occur.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of views on the relationship between mass and energy, with no consensus reached. Some agree on the equivalence of mass and energy, while others challenge this notion and raise questions about the implications of energy loss and the nature of photons.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include unresolved assumptions about the nature of mass and energy, the dependence on definitions of particles, and the complexities surrounding the behavior of photons and their role in energy transfer.

  • #31
Owen,

I am working on a new hypothesis that there are two kinds of mass. The potential mass and the kinetic mass. The potential mass is the same as inertial mass and gravitational mass. potential mass is a mass to resist motion. The kinetic mass is a mass to resist rest. Potential mass wants to stay put while kinetic mass wants to keep moving.

With this hypothesis, we can have another interpretation why the photon can have no potential mass and why the fermions can have no kinetic mass. When a fermion loses energy, it loses kinetic mass but gains potential mass
such that the total mass is conserved:

Total mass = potential mass + kinetic mass

Kinetic mass is another quantized form of energy.

When energy is quantized, the quantization process gives two forms of topologies. One topology for potential mass and one for kinetic mass.

What is actually being quantized is the square of energy. The vector form is:

Enery^2 = r_i \times F_i \cdot r_j \times F_j
 
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  • #32
AWolf said:
I think the humble little photon has more to do with particles than it's being credited with.
When electrons jump shelves, what's involved - photons.
When dealing with electromagnetic fields, what's involved - photons.
Heat transfer is infrared radiation - photons.
There may be theories, but I've not seen anything concrete.
You may take a look here:
https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=7611
 

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