Light approaching the event horizon

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the visual experience of an observer near the event horizon of a black hole, exploring the nature of light and visibility in such extreme gravitational conditions. Participants consider both theoretical and hypothetical scenarios regarding what can be seen as light approaches the black hole.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that light may appear "frozen in time" as it approaches the event horizon, suggesting an afterimage effect.
  • Others argue that light would simply vanish into the black hole due to its gravitational pull, making it impossible to see anything once it crosses the event horizon.
  • A participant raises the complexity of "seeing" light, noting that visibility depends on photons reaching the observer's retina, which would not happen for light that is pulled into the black hole.
  • One participant suggests using glowing particles, like radioactive sand, to explore visibility near the event horizon, questioning how they would appear as they approach the black hole.
  • Another participant mentions time dilation effects for observers near the black hole, indicating that objects would appear to stand still at the event horizon.
  • Several participants reference external resources, such as a specific figure in a PDF, to provide additional context or visual aids related to the discussion.
  • One participant emphasizes that anything entering a black hole becomes invisible, reiterating that light reflecting off particles would not reach the observer if it is drawn into the black hole.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express multiple competing views regarding the visibility of light and objects near the event horizon, with no consensus reached on what an observer would actually see.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the limitations of their discussion, including the dependence on definitions of visibility and the effects of time dilation, which remain unresolved.

permapoop
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What would you see if you were on an aircraft near it that could hypothetically survive?

Would you see light frozen in time, but technically gone? By that I mean would you just see an afterimage of it even though technically it's gone?

Or

Would you see light just vanish into the black hole in an instead due to the gravitational pull of the black hole?
 
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permapoop said:
What would you see if you were on an aircraft near it that could hypothetically survive?

Would you see light frozen in time, but technically gone? By that I mean would you just see an afterimage of it even though technically it's gone?

Or

Would you see light just vanish into the black hole in an instead due to the gravitational pull of the black hole?

It is confusing to talk about "seeing" particles of light the way we see objects (by having light scatter off of them and reach our eyes.)

You only "see" photons of light when they reach your retina and hit a nerve---IOW are detected.

How about some glow-in-the-dark dust or sand-grains, maybe it glows with blue light because of radioactivity or some chemical in it. Say some glowing sand, giving an eerie blue light?

How about you drop some of that down onto the BH horizon surface?

Would you be willing to change your question to be about that, instead of photons of light?

What would you (outside) see? Maybe you already know the answer?
 
Your question is a bit misleading, are you speaking of a stationary observer nearer to the BH or one in motion(space shuttle). Time dilation would occur and it'd get to a stand still at the EH (Objects) as far as the light approaching us goes well nothing beyond EH would ever appear to us since light itself is pulled towards the dense singularity.

Just a thought.
 
Take a look at Figure 16 on page 25 of

http://www.eftaylor.com/exploringblackholes/Seeing090601v2.pdf .
 
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Any thing that goes into a black hole becomes invisible. Even the black hole itself is invisible. So you wouldn't see any photons or particles once they get pulled into the black hole. Besides particles are only visible after light reflects off them and reaches our eyes. Where would the light that reflects off the particles reach the particles if all of it is sucked into the black hole?
 
George Jones said:
Take a look at Figure 16 on page 25 of

http://www.eftaylor.com/exploringblackholes/Seeing090601v2.pdf .

The E F Taylor draft second edition is wonderful, but that link no longer works. One has to start with the index, now, and hunt:
http://www.eftaylor.com/exploringblackholes/

The closest thing in the current draft, responding to the OP question, is probably current chapter 15
http://www.eftaylor.com/exploringblackholes/SeeingOrbiterRain110513v3.pdf
called "Final Views".

It describes very carefully what the observer sees who is falling into a BH.

The authors choose a large BH and start falling from far away, so that the fall takes several days and there is psychological time to imagine in detail---not just the BH itself but the view of the entire heavens as distorted by the BH gravity and by the fallingspeed aberration.

Amazing book. Second edition of "Exploring BH" (JA Wheeler coauthored first edition). GJ please correct if I have anything wrong here. Anybody else a fan of this book?
 
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