Magnetic Potential of Long Straight Wire: 65 Chars

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around finding the vector potential inside a long straight wire carrying a uniform current density. The original poster has derived the magnetic field and is now attempting to relate it to the vector potential using cylindrical coordinates.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the relationship between the vector potential and the magnetic field, particularly focusing on the radial dependence of the vector potential. There are questions about the implications of constants in the derived equations and the conditions under which the divergence of the vector potential is zero.

Discussion Status

Some participants have offered insights into the nature of the constants in the vector potential and the implications of gauge choices. There is an ongoing exploration of the relationship between the current density and the total current through the wire, with participants questioning definitions and seeking clarification on the derivation of the current density.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the problem involves assumptions about uniform current density and the need to satisfy specific equations such as Poisson's equation. There is also mention of the constraints imposed by homework rules regarding the form of the vector potential.

latentcorpse
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A long straight wire of radius R carries a unifrom current density \mathbf{J} inside it.

In the first part of the question I worked out that the magnetic field inside the wire was

\mathbf{B}=\frac{\mu_0 I r}{2 \pi R^2} \mathbf{\hat{\phi}}

I am now asked to get the vector potential insde the wire and give the hint of taking the curl in cylindrical polars. So far I have:

\mathbf{B}=\nabla \wedge \mathbf{A}
But \mathbf{A(r)}=\frac{\mu_0}{4 \pi} \int dV' \frac{\mathbf{J(r-r')}}{|\mathbf{r-r'}|}
so clearly it's parallel to \mathbf{J} which is in the z direction so we conclude that
A_r=A_{\phi}=0 and that A_z is non zero.

Taking the curl in cylindrical polars,

\nabla \wedge \mathbf{A}=\left(\frac{1}{r} \frac{\partial{A_z}}{\partial{\phi}}-\frac{\partial{A_{\phi}}}{\partial{z}} \right) \mathbf{\hat{r}} + \left(\frac{\partial{A_r}}{\partial{z}}-\frac{\partial{A_z}}{\partial{r}} \right) \mathbf{\hat{\phi}} + \frac{1}{r} \left(\frac{\partial}{\partial{r}}(rA_{\phi})-\frac{\partial{A_r}}{\partial{\phi}} \right) \mathbf{\hat{z}}
which whittles down to:
\nabla \wedge \mathbf{A}=\frac{1}{r} \frac{\partial{A_z}}{\partial{\phi}} \mathbf{\hat{r}} - \frac{\partial{A_z}}{\partial{r}} \mathbf{\hat{\phi}}

We have that this must be equal to \mathbf{B} which is given above, so by comparing terms we get

-\frac{\partial{A_z}}{\partial{r}}=\frac{\mu_0 I r}{2 \pi R^2} \Rightarrow -\int dA_z=\frac{\mu_0 I}{2 \pi R^2} \int r dr \Rightarrow A_z=-\frac{\mu_0 I}{4 \pi R^2}r^2 + const
and the otehr term gives:
\frac{\partial{A_z}}{\partial{\phi}}=0 \Rightarrow A_z is a constant, but in the line above, we found it to have radial dependence - something isn't quite right here, can anybody help me?
 
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latentcorpse said:
We have that this must be equal to \mathbf{B} which is given above, so by comparing terms we get

-\frac{\partial{A_z}}{\partial{r}}=\frac{\mu_0 I r}{2 \pi R^2} \Rightarrow -\int dA_z=\frac{\mu_0 I}{2 \pi R^2} \int r dr \Rightarrow A_z=-\frac{\mu_0 I}{4 \pi R^2}r^2 + const

The 'const' in this equation doesn't have to be a constant in all variables, it just can't have any r dependence (otherwise the partial derivative w.r.t. r of that "constant" term would be non-zero) It can however depend on \phi and z (For example, \frac{\partial}{\partial r} 5z^2\cos\phi=0 )

\implies A_z=-\frac{\mu_0 I}{4 \pi R^2}r^2+ g(\phi,z)

Where g is some unknown function of \phi and z
and the otehr term gives:
\frac{\partial{A_z}}{\partial{\phi}}=0 \Rightarrow A_z is a constant, but in the line above, we found it to have radial dependence - something isn't quite right here, can anybody help me?

Again, your constant need not be a constant, it just can't depend on \phi

\implies A_z=h(r,z)

Put the two conditions together and you find that A_z=-\frac{\mu_0 I}{4 \pi R^2}r^2 +f(z) satisfies both equations simultaneously for any function f(z)...You are free to choose any f(z) you like; as is typical since the vector potential is defined by a first order differential (the curl in this case) and so is only unique up to a 'constant' (in this case, your constant can depend on z without affecting B)
 
ok. thanks.

next I'm asked to show explicitly that this satisfies Poisson's equation, i.e.

\nabla^2 \mathbf{A}=-\mu_0 \mathbf{J}

and also that \nabla \cdot \mathbf{A}=0.

For the first part I have:
\nabla^2 \mathbf{A}=\nabla(\nabla \cdot \mathbf{A})-\nabla \wedge \nabla \wedge \mathbf{A} (taking the Laplacian of a vector.

then it makes more sense to show the divergence is 0 now to eliminate that term from the expansion of the laplacian.

\nabla \cdot \mathbf{A}=\frac{\partial{A_z}}{\partial{z}}=\frac{\partial{f(z)}}{\partial{z}} \neq 0 \forall f(z) \neq 0
bit confused here?



however assuming that works, we get \nabla^2 \mathbf{A}=-\nabla \wedge (\nabla \wedge \mathbf{A})=-\nabla \wedge \mathbf{B}

\nabla \wedge \mathbf{B}=-\frac{\partial{B_{\phi}}}{\partial{z}}\mathbf{\hat{r}} + \frac{1}{r} \frac{\partial}{\partial{r}} (r B_{\phi}) \mathbf{\hat{z}} as B_r=B_z=0

now \frac{\partial{B_{\phi}}}{\partial{z}}=0 as \mathbf{B}=\frac{\mu_0 I r}{2 \pi R^2} \mathbf{\hat{\phi}}

so \nabla \wedge \mathbf{B}=\frac{1}{r} \frac{\partial}{\partial{r}}(\frac{\mu_0 I r^2}{2 \pi R^2}) \mathbf{\hat{z}}=\frac{\mu_0 I}{\pi R^2}\mathbf{\hat{z}}

\Rightarrow\nabla^2 \mathbf{A}=-\mu_0 \frac{I}{\pi R^2}\mathbf{\hat{z}}

now my trouble is explaining why \mathbf{J}=\frac{I}{\pi R} \mathbf{\hat{z}}. Clearly the direction is fine and the untis seem ok as we have amperes/metre^2 - but there must be some definition I'm meant to use that I'm just missing in my notes?
 
Last edited:
latentcorpse said:
\nabla \cdot \mathbf{A}=\frac{\partial{A_z}}{\partial{z}}=\frac{\partial{f(z)}}{\partial{z}} \neq 0 \forall f(z) \neq 0
bit confused here?

Requiring \vec{\nabla}\cdot\vec{A}=0

corresponds to a specific gauge choice (it removes some of the freedom you normally have in chossing your 'constants'); so if you want to choose \vec{A} in a way that makes this true, just choose an f(z) with zero divergence (the simplest choice is just f(z)=0)

now my trouble is explaining why \mathbf{J}=\frac{I}{\pi R^2} \mathbf{\hat{z}}. Clearly the direction is fine and the untis seem ok as we have amperes/metre^2 - but there must be some definition I'm meant to use that I'm just missing in my notes?

Well, what is the total current passing through a cross-section of the wire if the volume current \vec{J} is uniform and runs in the z-direction?...since the total current is required to be I equate the two expressions and solve for J.
 
I=\int_S \mathbf{J} \cdot \mathbf{dA} \Rightarrow I=|\mathbf{J}| \pi R^2 \Rightarrow |\mathbf{J}|=\frac{I}{\pi R^2}

cheers m8.
 

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