North Korea Tensions: 48 Hr Ultimatum from North

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the recent tensions between North and South Korea, particularly focusing on North Korea's ultimatum to cease propaganda broadcasts. Participants explore the implications of these tensions, the nature of North Korean governance, and personal experiences related to visits to North Korea and the Demilitarized Zone (DMZ).

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Exploratory
  • Personal experience sharing

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants express concern that North Korea may miscalculate and escalate tensions, suggesting that the US should have intervened on humanitarian grounds.
  • There are observations about the leadership in North Korea, with some participants questioning the mental stability of Kim Jong-un and the lack of dissent within the government.
  • Personal accounts of visits to North Korea and the DMZ are shared, highlighting the contrast between the government's portrayal and the reality experienced by visitors.
  • Some participants argue that the North Korean regime uses external threats to bolster internal propaganda and maintain control over its population.
  • There are differing views on the effectiveness and implications of South Korean propaganda broadcasts, with some suggesting they are misleading while others defend their accuracy.
  • Concerns are raised about the potential humanitarian impact of any military conflict, emphasizing the suffering of innocent civilians in North Korea.
  • Some participants discuss the slow change within North Korea due to the influx of information from outside sources, suggesting that this could lead to greater awareness among the population.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of views on the motivations and stability of the North Korean regime, the effectiveness of propaganda, and the potential consequences of military conflict. There is no clear consensus on these issues, indicating ongoing disagreement and uncertainty.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference various articles and personal experiences, but there are limitations in the assumptions made about the motivations of the North Korean government and the accuracy of propaganda. The discussion also reflects a mix of personal anecdotes and broader geopolitical analysis.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to those studying international relations, North Korean politics, or individuals seeking personal accounts of experiences in North Korea and the DMZ.

Student100
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Looks like they're exchanging fire again, and the North has given the South 48 hours to cease propaganda broadcasts: http://www.cnn.com/2015/08/20/asia/koreas-tensions/

Personally I wait for the day the North miscalculates and over reacts with their saber rattling, the US should have liberated the North decades ago on purely humanitarian grounds.

I don't think that's going to happen anytime soon though, the North depends on businesses as usual to remain in power.
 
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Student100 said:
North depends on businesses as usual to remain in power.
Yeesss, and at the same time this is the third generation of "loose gun on deck." It's not obvious that the kid is "all there," and it is obvious that no one in the North Korean government can tell him "No" and make it stick.
 
Student100 said:
I've been to the DMZ but never into the north, it'll be interesting to hear what his thoughts are.
I've been on both sides. DPRK was one of my most interesting trips.
 
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Greg Bernhardt said:
I've been on both sides :smile:

What's it like on the other side? :wink:
 
Student100 said:
What's it like on the other side? :wink:
I spent two weeks over there 4 years ago. They showed me what they wanted me to see. Told me what they wanted me to hear. I constantly debated with myself on what was real and what was for show. I think there is equal fear and brainwashing/ignorance in the population. It's all very fascinating but sad.
 
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Student100 said:
Personally I wait for the day the North miscalculates and over reacts with their saber rattling, the US should have liberated the North decades ago on purely humanitarian grounds.
And Seoul will be shelled into oblivion
 
The DPRK use these encounters to feed internal propaganda and patriotism. The US and SK are the boogeymen necessary for their system to work. They are taught that US ships are always right around the corner and that SK is a hell hole. Like the Nazi's, North Koreans are taught they are the pure breed.
 
  • #10
I've also never felt safer and the general people are very kind. As always it's the government that screws things up.
 
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  • #11
Greg Bernhardt said:
The DPRK use these encounters to feed internal propaganda and patriotism. The US and SK are the boogeymen necessary for their system to work. They are taught that US ships are always right around the corner and that SK is a hell hole. Like the Nazi's, North Koreans are taught they are the pure breed.

Yeah, the North Korean government definitely depends on the rhetoric and saber rattling to stay in power. That's why they use that tactic and small scale confrontations so often. I don't think Kim is crazy or delusional enough to really think he could win a conflict.

And Seoul will be shelled into oblivion

Or the so the DPRK like's to remind everyone. :smile:

The sad part is that plenty of innocent people would die in a conflict, but generations of humans rights abuses in the North, that appear are going to continue indefinitely, might be the greater evil.

I spent two weeks over there 4 years ago. They showed me what they wanted me to see. Told me what they wanted me to hear. I constantly debated with myself on what was real and what was for show. I think there is equal fear and brainwashing/ignorance in the population. It's all very fascinating but sad.

Very interesting, I would feel completely out of my skin in the North. It would definitely be a harrowing experience.
 
  • #12
Greg Bernhardt said:
I've also never felt safer and the general people are very kind. As always it's the government that screws things up.

Isn't that always the truth.

The south has said they won't stop the propaganda broadcasts, so it looks like additional small skirmishes are likely.
 
  • #13
Student100 said:
I don't think Kim is crazy or delusional enough to really think he could win a conflict.

Agreed, they are not stupid. All they want is for status quo of luxury for the elite.

Student100 said:
The sad part is that plenty of innocent people would die in a conflict, but generations of humans rights abuses in the North, that appear are going to continue indefinitely, might be the greater evil.

It will slowly change. Cell phone smuggling and border radios allow information to get in. The people just need the information. Doubt will start to creep in and then change can happen.

Student100 said:
Very interesting, I would feel completely out of my skin in the North. It would definitely be a harrowing experience.

It's certainly intimidating at first, but you have to go via a chinese tour group. They take care of everything for you and you're never alone.
 
  • #14
Student100 said:
propaganda broadcasts:
prop·a·gan·da
ˌpräpəˈɡandə/
noun
  1. 1.
    derogatory
    information, especially of a biased or misleading nature, used to promote or publicize a particular political cause or point of view.
CNN is only half right in using the term to label the S. Korean broadcasts. The broadcasts no doubt have a particular point of view, but I disagree they are misleading, at all, in claiming that Kim Un is doing a lousy job and that a better life is available in S. Korea.
 
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  • #15
Latest timeline: https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/asia_pacific/the-latest-on-koreas-n-korea-says-ready-for-all-out-war/2015/08/21/8bcd59c2-4865-11e5-9f53-d1e3ddfd0cda_story.html

The deadline came and went, with the two entering into high level talks.Talks are set to resume today at 3pm local time.
 
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