Petraeus: US Surge Goals Being Met

[rewebster]

You say a lot of "spot-on" things.

Please remember that the American people have lost their patience after being lied to so many times. We are angry and want change NOW.

I was thinking it sounded more like Ann Coulter more than anything else.

 

[kach22i]

You speak as if I am from another country.

Nawwwwwwwwww...Scarborough country maybe (smile).

 

[turbo]

There lives are important, but not as important as our troops. Why? Because if some Iraqis die but in the process of attaining a stable government, that's fine. If Americans die in the process, people will question why we are wasting our time there. Its not a PC answer, but it is the truth. And I put the lives of the troops before the lives of foreign nationals (from any other nation).

Cyrus, all human lives are precious. These people have parents, spouses, children, and they deserve to live in some modicum of peace and security. When you said 300 people had been killed since the beginning of the surge, it was evident that you hold Iraqi lives in no regard. They are the victims of this war, and their lives are on the heads of out government officials that will not pursue all means to ramp down the violence, including talking to and negotiating with people our administration has demonized.

There is a reason why its not being done right now - its not easy. Furthermore, Iran has had bad relations with the US for the last 30 years. The countries don't want to help the US because they want to have major influence over Iraq once the US leaves.

Iran has had bad elations with the US because just like now in Iraq, the US imposed regime change on them and set the stage for radical Islamic groups to take over after the Shah was deposed. The US under Eisenhower started Iran's nuclear industry. Moderate groups in Iran have been trying to foster better relations with the US for years, but ultra-conservatives and the Israeli bloc in our government have shot that down.

I never deominized anyone, but you did countless times.

I have stated the obvious. You made the claim that China would grab Iraq's oil and fuel their insurgency with no regard for the consequences. I assume you have some references.

They signed up to fight when their country asked them to fight, and that's exactly what they are doing. Grated the Bush administration ****ed things up on a colossal scale, but that does not mean you give up and leave. What should be done is the general should fight to have things done the right way in Iraq.

The signed up to defend this country. Some of them signed up after 9/11 after Bushco conflated 9/11 and Iraq (the most favorite lie of this administration) and some were hauled back into service because they were members of the National Guard or their reserve time was not up. Since then, even if their reservist obligations have been met, they are prevented from leaving by "stop-loss" regulations. Many of these guys had started small businesses, and have lost their businesses during the repeated deployments, plunging their families into poverty and making them dependent on charity. Nice, huh?

The don't complain when the general tells you he needs more time to stabilize the country! You want your cake and you want to eat it too.

You miss the point entirely. The country cannot be stabilized by military occupation and policing patrols. It needs to stabilized by diplomatic initiatives and Bushco refuses to engage in regional diplomacy. Petraeus has said "give us more time", but more time without effective regional diplomacy is simply more killing, and more loss of Iraqi life and US lives. The status quo is not acceptable, since it is simply an extension of the violence, suffering, wounding, and killing. Petraeus gave Bush the cover he needed in Congress to keep killing more Iraqis and more US men and women.

Look, believe me I am on you're side. But your posts make too much blame on a good general in a tough situation. Everyone seems to like the guy in washington. When you post things like "He deserves no respect", you make your post lose credibility and seem silly. You want a straight answer? You enstate a draft and triple the number of troops in Iraq, drag every insurgent you find in the street and shoot him in the head, and close down every boarder into the country until things stabilize.

Petraeus had a once-in-a-lifetime chance to do real good and save lives by pointing out that diplomacy is key, and is largely absent. He squandered that by trading those lives for the chance to save Bush's "policy", which is just keep sacrificing more people until someone sane inhabits the White House. There should be a team of diplomats in a friendly bordering country like Saudi Arabia negotiating around the clock with representatives of the other countries in the region. Why is that not happening?

 

[Cyrus]

I have stated the obvious. You made the claim that China would grab Iraq's oil and fuel their insurgency with no regard for the consequences. I assume you have some references.

Forgive me, I assumed you follow the news:

Selling arms to African countries helps China cement relationships with African leaders and helps offset the costs of buying oil from them. China doesn't have the same human rights concerns as the United States and European countries, experts say, so it will sell military hardware and weapons to nearly anyone. Indeed, Beijing sees Africa as a growth market for its military hardware. China's active exploration of oil sources in Africa also leads to a need to ensure security around them, experts say, which has led Beijing to send Chinese military trainers to help their African counterparts. In return, China gains important African allies in the United Nations--including Sudan, Zimbabwe, and Nigeria--for its political goals, including preventing Taiwanese independence and diverting attention from its own human rights record. A report, "China's Arms Sales: Motivations and Implications" by Daniel Byman and Roger Cliff for the RAND Corporation, says China's government exerts strong central control over its arms exports and uses them as a foreign policy tool.

Sudan. China has sold the Islamic government in Khartoum weapons and $100 million worth of Shenyang fighter planes, including twelve supersonic F-7 jets, according to the aerospace industry journal Aviation Week and Space Technology. Experts say any military air presence exercised by the government--including the helicopter gunships reportedly used to terrorize civilians in Darfur--comes from China.
Equatorial Guinea. China has provided military training and Chinese specialists in heavy military equipment to the leaders of the tiny East African nation, whose oil reserves per capita approach and may exceed those of Saudi Arabia.
Ethiopia and Eritrea. China sold Ethiopia and its neighbor, Eritrea, an estimated $1 billion worth of weapons before and during their border war from 1998 and 2000.

http://www.nytimes.com/cfr/international/slot2_011806.html

 

[kach22i]

I know someone that works in Africa in the oil industry. There is a war of sorts between China and Europe/USA for African oil access. It's bigger than the war in Iraq by many measures, you just don't hear about it. It's the next big global battle ground.
................


General Betraeus...is not a name "Moveon" made up it now looks like.

From The Sunday Times
August 19, 2007
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/iraq/article2284289.ece?Submitted=true

AFTER being hailed as King David, the potential saviour of Iraq, the US commander General David Petraeus is facing a backlash in advance of his report to Congress in September on the progress of America’s troop surge.

Critics, including one recently retired general, are privately calling him “General Betraeus” on the grounds that he is too ambitious to deliver a balanced report on the war.

http://www.blackfive.net/main/2005/11/generals_of_yes.html

Posted by: Brad R. Torgersen | November 18, 2005 at 07:23 PM

I don't know GEN Petraeus personally...but when I was in the "Devil Brigade" folks called him "Colonel Betrayus". He came up with things like the "Devil button" (button your BDU collar up to the top when on jumps) and the "Devil grip" (special name for keeping your trigger finger out of the trigger well) which sounded hokey to most of the troops at the time.

Can any other All American paratroopers out there expand on my comment?

The MoveOn ad in question - for reference:
https://pol.moveon.org/petraeus.html

 

[Supercritical]

Update:

Press Briefing, Nov. 18

Security trends continue to improve here in Iraq. Overall, terrorist attacks are at their lowest levels since January 2006, are 55% lower now than at the beginning of the surge when the surge began in June, with some areas experiencing attacks levels not observed this low since the spring and summer of 2005. Civilian fatalities have decreased 60% in Iraq during that same period, and in Baghdad, civilian deaths have decreased by 75%, which certainly accounts for some of the increased optimism we’re seeing by local civilians and local officials here in Baghdad... (briefing continues)

Slides

http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/7427/slidesj6.png is of particular interest