Phosphate Buffer and pH: Would it be Effective at pH 8.5? - Homework Discussion

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the effectiveness of phosphate buffers at different pH levels, specifically whether a phosphate buffer would be effective at a pH of 8.5 compared to its typical use at a pH of 7.45. The context is a homework problem involving buffer chemistry and the application of the Henderson-Hasselbalch equation.

Discussion Character

  • Homework-related
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant states that since the pH of 8.5 is between pKa2 and pKa3, phosphate would not gain or lose a hydrogen ion, suggesting it might still be effective as a buffer.
  • Another participant challenges this view, asserting that the effectiveness of buffers is not solely determined by their pKa values relative to the pH.
  • A later reply indicates that phosphate would be less effective at a higher pH because it is greater than pKa2, and notes that pKa3's much smaller Ka value implies lower dissociation/association at that pH.
  • One participant emphasizes that buffer effectiveness is related to the distance of the pH from the respective pKa values, highlighting that 7.45 is close to pKa2 (7.2).
  • Another participant suggests that reviewing a titration curve for weak acids or bases could provide further insight into the buffer's behavior.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the effectiveness of phosphate buffers at pH 8.5, with no consensus reached on whether it would be as effective as at pH 7.45. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the implications of pKa values on buffer capacity.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved assumptions regarding the specific conditions under which phosphate buffers operate effectively, and the discussion does not clarify the mathematical steps involved in determining buffer capacity at different pH levels.

ReidMerrill
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Homework Statement


Phosphate, present to an extent of 0.01 M, is one of the main buffers in blood plasma, whose pH is 7.45. Would phosphate be as useful if the plasma pH were 8.5?

Homework Equations


pH = pKa+log[A/HA]
Ka1 = 7.11x10^-3 pka1= 2.148
Ka2=6.34x10^-8 pka2= 7.198
Ka3 = 4.22x10^-13 pka3=12.375

The Attempt at a Solution


Since the pH would still be between pka2 and pka3 so the phosphate would not gain or lose a hydrogen because of that change and the henderson-hasselbalch equation would still use the same pka. Does this mean it would be just as effective at pH 8.5 or am I missing something?
 
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You don't have to follow the derivation, but part of the text on that page contains exactly information that you need. Scroll down to the plot and the explanation.
 
Borek said:
You don't have to follow the derivation, but part of the text on that page contains exactly information that you need. Scroll down to the plot and the explanation.
Okay so that phosphate wouldn't be as good of a buffer at a higher pH because it's greater than the pKa2? 8.5 is closer to pKa3 but since its ka3 is so much smaller than Ka2 that dissociation/association would be much lower.
 
I feel like you are still missing the point. How effective a buffer is depends on how far pH is from the respective pKa value. 7.45 is quite close to 7.2.
 
You must have seen the titration curve for a weak acid or base. Sketch or look up what it looks like.
You might have to turn it sideways for best understanding.
 

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