Proportion of dark energy and dark matter

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the proportions of dark energy, dark matter, and regular matter in the universe, specifically questioning whether these proportions are constant over time or subject to change. Participants explore implications for cosmological models, particularly in relation to the cosmological constant and scenarios like the Big Rip.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that dark energy constitutes about 72% of the universe's mass density, dark matter about 23%, and regular matter about 5%, questioning if these proportions change over time.
  • One participant suggests that as the universe expands, the density of dark matter and ordinary matter decreases, while dark energy density remains constant or may even increase, referencing the Big Rip scenario.
  • Another participant agrees that observational data appears consistent with dark energy density being constant, proposing a value of around 0.65 nanojoules per cubic meter, but acknowledges uncertainty about whether dark energy might slowly change over time.
  • There is a mention of the standard cosmological model (LCDM) predicting that in the distant future, the universe will consist of nearly 0% matter and over 99% dark energy, without leading to a Big Rip scenario.
  • Some participants express skepticism about conflating dark energy and dark matter, arguing they have fundamentally different properties.
  • One participant notes that the relative proportions of dark energy, dark matter, and regular matter have changed dramatically over time, with dark energy expected to dominate in the distant future, while normal matter was predominant a few billion years ago.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants exhibit a mix of agreement and disagreement. While some acknowledge a potential constancy in dark energy density, others argue that the proportions of different components of the universe change over time. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the implications of these changes and the nature of dark energy.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference various documents and articles to support their claims, but there are issues with link accessibility and some participants question the reliability of sources. The discussion includes speculative scenarios about the future of the universe and the behavior of dark energy.

Ranku
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Dark energy is observed to constitute about 72% of the mass density of the universe, dark matter about 23%, and regular matter about 5%. Is this proportion always like this or does it change over time? If it does change, how does one reconcile it with the requirement that the cosmological constant requires dark energy to have a constant energy density?
 
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As I understand, when Universe expands, density of DM and ordinary matter decreases
DE density is the same or even increases (the Big Rip scenario)
 
Ranku said:
Dark energy is observed to constitute about 72% of the mass density of the universe, dark matter about 23%, and regular matter about 5%. Is this proportion always like this or does it change over time?

Hello Ranku

This document gives an idea of the past and future distributions of regular matter, dark matter & dark energy (page 5)-

http://preposterousuniverse.com/writings/skytel-mar05.pdf

EDIT-
Copy attached.
 

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I agree with Dmitry. Only I don't think very much about the big rip scenarios.
Ranku said:
Dark energy is observed to constitute about 72% of the mass density of the universe, dark matter about 23%, and regular matter about 5%. Is this proportion always like this or does it change over time? If it does change, how does one reconcile it with the requirement that the cosmological constant requires dark energy to have a constant energy density?

So far I believe the observational data has been consistent with the dark energy density being constant.
Roughly something around 0.65 nanojoule per cubic meter.
The same everywhere and constant through time.

This would be consistent with having a positive cosmological constant Lambda. That assumption gives rise to the standard mainstream cosmological model: LCDM. The L stands for Lambda.

But one cannot be 100% sure! Maybe the dark energy is not exactly constant. Maybe it is very slowly changing and we just have not yet seen this in the data. I personally don't spend much time thinking about this but the possibility is studied in the NASA reports on the 5th year WMAP data. It has not yet been ruled out.

Because dark matter thins out, on average, along with ordinary matter, the standard LCDM model predicts that in the far far distant future the makeup of the universe will be nearly 0% matter and over 99% dark energy. This will not be big rip. We will still have our galaxy and our solar system pretty much as usual. But there won't be much in the way of other galaxies around, and the stars will not be so good and it may get cold.

There is an article about what can be expected, by cosmologist Lawrence Krauss. He describes what will happen according to the LCDM model. You might like it. He is reputable and a good writer.
http://arxiv.org/abs/0704.0221
 
stevebd1 said:
Hello Ranku

This document gives an idea of the past and future distributions of regular matter, dark matter & dark energy (page 5)-

http://preposterousuniverse.com/writings/skytel-mar05.pdf

The link doesn't work. Is the article by Sean Carroll? Could you check the link and repaste it please?
 
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Ranku said:
The link doesn't work. Is the article by Sean Carroll? Could you check the link and repaste it please?

The link works for me. The reference is
  • Sean Carroll (2005) http://preposterousuniverse.com/writings/skytel-mar05.pdf , in Sky & Telescope, Mar 2005, pp 32-39.

Cheers -- sylas
 
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I tire of hearing about DE and DM in the same sentence. Dark matter and dark energy have nothing in common save for the word 'dark'.
 
Ranku said:
Dark energy is observed to constitute about 72% of the mass density of the universe, dark matter about 23%, and regular matter about 5%. Is this proportion always like this or does it change over time? If it does change, how does one reconcile it with the requirement that the cosmological constant requires dark energy to have a constant energy density?
Yes, the relative proportions of the various components of the universe change dramatically with respect to time, depending upon the physics of the various components. From what we know now, going into the distant future, essentially all of the energy density will probably be in dark energy. A few billion years ago, nearly all of the density was in normal matter. In the very early universe, nearly all of it was in radiation.
 
sylas said:
The link works for me. The reference is
  • Sean Carroll (2005) http://preposterousuniverse.com/writings/skytel-mar05.pdf , in Sky & Telescope, Mar 2005, pp 32-39.

Cheers -- sylas

Thanks for the link. Very good review article.
 
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  • #10
stevebd1 said:
Hello Ranku

This document gives an idea of the past and future distributions of regular matter, dark matter & dark energy (page 5)-

http://preposterousuniverse.com/writings/skytel-mar05.pdf

EDIT-
Copy attached.

Thank you for the file attached. Very helpful article.
 
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