Optimizing Inequality with Constraints

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around proving a specific inequality under various constraints related to the variables involved. Participants explore different approaches and constraints to determine if the inequality can be established, focusing on mathematical reasoning and potential adjustments to the conditions given.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents an inequality involving variables a, x, y, and z, and seeks to prove it under certain constraints.
  • Another participant provides a counterexample that suggests the inequality may not hold under the initial conditions.
  • A subsequent reply proposes adding the constraint y + z > x to see if it changes the outcome.
  • One participant attempts to prove the inequality with the new constraint and provides specific values for a, x, y, and z, claiming the inequality holds true.
  • Another participant expresses skepticism about the validity of the approach when the variables are small, suggesting that the method may not be robust in that case.
  • Further discussion includes a participant's attempt to refine their constraints but indicates difficulty in establishing a general proof.
  • Finally, one participant suggests a new set of constraints they believe could work, including specific inequalities among the variables.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the validity of the inequality or the effectiveness of the proposed constraints. Multiple competing views and approaches are presented, and the discussion remains unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Participants express uncertainty regarding the sufficiency of the constraints and the generality of the proof attempts. There are indications that the validity of the inequality may depend on the specific values of the variables involved.

nasshi
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I'm interested in proving the following inequality, given the following constraints. This is for personal gain, and not for homework. I'm not even sure if I can prove this without additional constraints. If you can solve it by adding constraints, please let me know what options I have for adding constraints.

Given:
0<a<1
x>0, y>0, z>0
x>y

Prove:\frac{x-y}{(1+x)(1+y)} &lt; \frac{z*a}{1+y+z}

Thanks so much for your help!
 
Last edited:
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I believe it's proven wrong with the example, (a,x,y,z)=(1/2,2,1,1).
 
You are indeed correct.

How about we add the constraint:
y+z&gt;x

What about now?
 
Well y+z>x really just means z>x in your case, but I'll try to prove it:

<br /> \frac {x-y}{(1+x)(1+y)}&lt;\frac {z*a}{1+y+z}

Fallowing constraints, we set (a,x,y,z) to (1/2,2,1,2)

<br /> <br /> \frac {2-1}{(1+2)(1+1)}&lt;\frac {2*1/2}{1+1+2}

\frac {1}{6}&lt;\frac {1}{4}

This proves true.
Assume (a,x,y,z)\longrightarrow(a+1,x+1,y+1,z+1); plug in the original set.

\frac {(x+1)-(y+1)}{(1+(x+1))(1+(y+1))}&lt;\frac {(z+1)(a+1)}{1+(y+1)+(z+1)}

\frac {x-y}{(x+2)(y+2)}&lt;\frac {(z+1)(a+1)}{y+z+3}

Now plug in, and simplify:

\frac {2-1}{(2+2)(1+2)}&lt;\frac {(2+1)(1/2+1)}{1+2+3}

\frac {1}{12}&lt;\frac {9}{12}

I don't know if this is formal, but I'd call it adequate.
 
I think it works well for larger values of x,y,z. But when x,y,z are small, for example, between 0 and 1, I think your method won't work.
 
I should have set (a,x,y,z) to (d,2d,d,3d) and (1-d,2d,d,3d).
Anyways, you have to fix your constraints...
 
I can't exactly "fix my constraints". I'm trying to prove something as generally as possible. Can you think of any constraints I can add that would easily establish the desired result? Because I can't.
 
Here are some constraints that I think work:
x>y
0<y<1
a>6
z>2/35
 

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