Proving Boundedness of Double Index Array | Math Problem

  • Context: Graduate 
  • Thread starter Thread starter linuxux
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Array Index
Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the problem of proving the boundedness of a double index array defined by the summation of absolute values of its elements. Participants are attempting to understand the implications of the boundedness of the set {t_{mn}} and its relation to the convergence of the sequence (t_{nn}). The scope includes mathematical reasoning and conceptual clarification regarding double summations and convergence criteria.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion about proving that the set {t_{mn}} is bounded, questioning how this relates to the absolute convergence of the doubly indexed array.
  • Another participant points out that without specific information about the elements a_{ij}, it is difficult to establish boundedness, providing an example where a_{ij} = 1 leads to unbounded t_{mn}.
  • A later reply reiterates the lack of information about the a_{ij}s, emphasizing that this absence prevents proving the assertion of boundedness.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that the lack of information about the elements a_{ij} complicates the proof of boundedness. There is disagreement regarding the implications of the boundedness of {t_{mn}} and whether it can be established without additional constraints on a_{ij}.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights the importance of assumptions regarding the elements of the double index array, as the boundedness of the set {t_{mn}} is contingent upon these definitions. The relationship between boundedness and absolute convergence remains unresolved.

linuxux
Messages
133
Reaction score
0
I'm just don't get this question.

from my text:

[tex]define\ t_{mn}\ =\ \sum^{m}_{i=1}\sum^{n}_{j=1}|a_{ij}|,[/tex]
[tex][a_{ij}\ is\ a\ doubly\ indexed\ array\ of\ real\ numbers.][/tex]
[tex](a)\ prove\ that\ the\ set\ \{t_{mn}\ :\ m,n\ \in\ N\}\ is\ bounded\ above.[/tex]
[tex](b)\ use\ (a)\ to\ conclude\ that\ (t_{nn})\ converges.[/tex]

This has been confusing me for a couple of days, I've got the rest of the proof, but this part doesn't make any sense. The theorem I'm trying to prove states "IF the doubly indexed array converges absolutely," but if I "prove" {t_mn} is bounded, it suggest then that every doubly indexed array would converge absolutely, so I'm not sure how i can possibly answer (a).

From what i understand, the set {t_mn} is all the possible outcomes of the double summation, for instance, the first member would be a_11, the second might be a_11 + a_12 or a_11 + a_21, etc. But that set has no bound. It can grow as much as it wants, i think.

i'm not sure where I'm going wrong here. please help, thanks.
 
Last edited:
Physics news on Phys.org
You're not given ANY information about the [tex]a_{ij}[/tex]s?
That's odd. Take [tex]a_{ij}=1[/tex] for all i, j. Then
[tex]t_{mn} = m \times n[/tex] which is of course NOT bounded above - correct me if I'm mistaken.

--------
Assaf
http://www.physicallyincorrect.com/"
 
Last edited by a moderator:
ozymandias said:
You're not given ANY information about the [tex]a_{ij}[/tex]s?
That's odd. Take [tex]a_{ij}=1[/tex] for all i, j. Then
[tex]t_{mn} = m \times n[/tex] which is of course NOT bounded above - correct me if I'm mistaken.

--------
Assaf
http://www.physicallyincorrect.com/"

Well, the book was introducing double sums, and at one point it defined the "rectangular partial sums":
[tex]s_{mn}\ =\ \sum^{m}_{i=1}\sum^{n}_{j=1}a_{ij},\ for\ m,n\ \in\ N.[/tex]
And before it defined t_mn, it said "in the same way that we define the 'rectangular partial sums' s_mn above, define t_mn (as indicated above)"

however, it did not specifiy in any way that s_mn converged, all it said was that "in this case the order of the sum doesn't matter since the sum is finite."
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Still, without any information about the a_ijs, we cannot prove the assertion.

--------
Assaf
http://www.physicallyincorrect.com/"
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Similar threads

  • · Replies 26 ·
Replies
26
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
4K
Replies
7
Views
4K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 51 ·
2
Replies
51
Views
11K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K