Discussion Overview
The discussion revolves around the attempt to prove that no set can contain all sets without invoking Russell's paradox. Participants explore logical reasoning and mathematical formulations related to set theory, particularly focusing on the implications of a set containing itself and the consequences of such a condition.
Discussion Character
- Exploratory
- Technical explanation
- Debate/contested
- Mathematical reasoning
Main Points Raised
- Rich B. proposes an argument that if a set S contains itself, then it cannot contain all sets, as it leads to a contradiction when considering other elements X not equal to S.
- Evgeny.Makarov requests clarification on whether Rich B. means "S is an element of S" or "S is a subset of S" and questions the reasoning behind the claim that S - S cannot be empty.
- Rich B. confirms that he means "S is an element of S" and expresses uncertainty about the reasoning regarding S - S.
- Participants provide guidance on how to properly format mathematical symbols using LaTeX in the forum.
- A later post suggests that Cantor's Diagonal Theorem supports the conclusion that there is no greatest cardinal number and thus no set of all sets, although this point is not universally accepted in the thread.
Areas of Agreement / Disagreement
Participants express differing views on the validity of Rich B.'s argument and the implications of set theory principles. There is no consensus on the correctness of the reasoning presented, and the discussion remains unresolved regarding the proof's validity.
Contextual Notes
Rich B.'s argument relies on specific assumptions about set membership and the nature of sets, which may not be universally accepted or clearly defined among participants. The discussion includes unresolved questions about the logical steps involved in the argument.