Quantum Gravity Research Group -- any standing in mainstream Physics?

Click For Summary
SUMMARY

The Quantum Gravity Research Group and its Emergence Theory lack standing in mainstream physics, as confirmed by multiple contributors in the discussion. Emergence Theory combines combinatorial quantum gravity concepts with metaphysical ideas, but it is considered mathematically underdeveloped compared to established frameworks like string theory and loop quantum gravity. The group's research output is viewed as second- or third-tier, primarily consisting of modifications to existing models rather than a coherent theory. Overall, the consensus is that Emergence Theory does not meet the rigorous standards of mainstream scientific inquiry.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of quantum gravity frameworks, including string theory and loop quantum gravity.
  • Familiarity with combinatorial theories in physics.
  • Knowledge of mathematical concepts related to E8 theory and its implications.
  • Awareness of the philosophical implications of panpsychism and panprotopsychism.
NEXT STEPS
  • Research the mathematical foundations of loop quantum gravity and its criticisms.
  • Explore the implications of E8 theory in modern physics.
  • Investigate the philosophical aspects of panpsychism and its relevance to quantum theories.
  • Examine the latest developments in string theory and its relationship with quantum gravity.
USEFUL FOR

Physicists, researchers in quantum gravity, and anyone interested in the philosophical implications of emerging theories in physics will benefit from this discussion.

andrew s 1905
Messages
238
Reaction score
95
I would like to know if this group http://www.quantumgravityresearch.org/ and its Emergence Theory has any standing in main stream Physics.

Thanks Andrew
 
Physics news on Phys.org
It's definitely not mainstream, and wouldn't be mainstream even if it was the work of someone at Oxford or Harvard.

In the world of quantum gravity, there are frameworks that preserve space as a continuum, like string theory and various field theories, and then there are more combinatorial theories like loop quantum gravity and causal dynamical triangulation.

From what I understand so far, "Emergence Theory" combines a combinatorial idea of quantum gravity, to be based on tetrahedra, E8, and the golden ratio, with a metaphysics in which "measurement" is happening everywhere all the time. It sounds like panpsychism (everything is conscious), or perhaps what David Chalmers calls panprotopsychism (everything is almost conscious).

Occasionally university physicists publish comparable ideas (e.g. Teruaki Nakagomi's "Quantum monadology", or maybe some of David Finkelstein's later work), but those are eccentric works. Also, if we focus just on the geometric aspect of Emergence Theory... so far, it seems to have even less substance than Louis Crane's E6 neutrinos. Is there a lagrangian or a partition function somewhere, or is there just an aspiration to build a model out of the ingredients specified?

So I would think of it like this. Just with respect to quantum gravity, the most mainstream you can get is the quantum field theory of gravity you get by quantizing general relativity in various straightforward ways, like perturbative field theory or Hawking's wavefunction of the universe. Then you have the unproven theories which try to build on that in some way, above all string theory (for numerous reasons) and asymptotic safety (because it does have a few successes). Then you have the combinatorial frameworks, above all loop quantum gravity. Most of us in the continuum camp have strong technical criticisms of loop quantum gravity, but I think I have to count it as mainstream.

The purely geometric part of Emergence Theory appears to be two steps removed from mainstream combinatorial quantum gravity, if we rank theories by mathematical substance. One step removed would be Louis Crane's model, linked above, mostly because it hasn't been shown that it makes sense mathematically. Crane is a mathematician, and he has some ideas, but he hasn't defined a model even at the level of the other papers he's written on the subject. And then "Emergence Theory" doesn't even have something like Crane's E6/A4 duality. Though maybe it hopes to employ something from Lisi's E8 theory??

Anyway, what I'm saying is that mathematically, unless I've missed something substantial, there doesn't seem to be much there in "Emergence Theory" except the hope that the prioritized ingredients can actually be soldered together into a functioning theory. So the "Research Group" is a group of people - they are actual physicists - tinkering with these concepts in the hope of eventually having them cohere. And they are writing and even publishing some papers, in journals of mixed quality, about these other investigations. For example, in their publication list I saw a paper about cosmology, and another one about quasicrystals. What I believe they're doing is tweaking established models in ways that they hope would eventually be motivated by Emergence Theory, once it's a real theory. But in those cases, for now all they have is the modified establishment model.

On the basis of what I've seen, my instant opinion is that there's too little deep math for Emergence Theory as it is to be the answer to anything, and that its apparent adherence to the combinatorial philosophy of quantum gravity also ought to doom it. But I do find the metaphysics intriguing, and even the idea that some of these remarkable algebras like E8 might have a "cognitive" interpretation (see the 1990s collaboration on octonions, between Kent Palmer, Onar Aam, and Ben Goertzel). E8 does have a self-referential quality to it. So I think their concrete research output is second- or third-tier, it's more contributions to the ever-growing literature of models that aren't right and which have some flaws of principle. But I like some of their spirit.

But that's just a personal opinion, and one based on a rather quick and superficial examination of their material. Anyway, by any reasonable standard, they are definitely not mainstream.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Hasan Delifer, Buzz Bloom, atyy and 3 others
mitchell porter said:
But that's just a personal opinion, and one based on a rather quick and superficial examination of their material. Anyway, by any reasonable standard, they are definitely not mainstream.
Thanks for this detailed answer. I think we should close the thread here, because we are committed to mainstream science.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: andrew s 1905

Similar threads

  • · Replies 26 ·
Replies
26
Views
5K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
4K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
3K
  • · Replies 20 ·
Replies
20
Views
5K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
4K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
4K
  • · Replies 16 ·
Replies
16
Views
6K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
4K