Solving a Relativistic Momentum Problem with Differential Equations

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around solving a differential equation related to relativistic momentum, specifically for an electron subjected to a constant force. Participants explore the implications of the momentum formula and the application of Newton's second law in a relativistic context, addressing the challenge of finding the velocity as a function of time and the distance traveled.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents the relativistic momentum formula and expresses confusion about solving the resulting differential equation.
  • Another participant clarifies the relationship between force and momentum, suggesting a simpler form of the equation using the Lorentz factor, γ.
  • A different participant questions the initial approach of taking the derivative of momentum, proposing that integrating the given equation directly is more straightforward.
  • Participants discuss the integration process and the implications for finding velocity and distance, with one noting that the integration step is trivial.
  • One participant acknowledges their initial confusion and expresses gratitude for the assistance received, indicating they were able to solve the problem.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

There is no explicit consensus on the best approach to solving the problem, as participants present differing methods and interpretations of the steps involved. Some participants agree on the correctness of the derivative taken, while others suggest alternative methods that may be simpler.

Contextual Notes

Participants express uncertainty about the complexity of the differential equation and the integration process, highlighting that assumptions about the simplicity of the problem may have been misleading.

la6ki
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I've been trying to work on differential equations using several books and one of the first exercise questions I encountered already has me stuck.

The momentum p of an electron at speed v near the speed c of light increases
according to the formula p=mv/√(1-v^2/c^2), where m is a constant. If an electron is subject to a constant force F, Newton's second law describing its motion is

\frac{dp}{dt}=\frac{d}{dt}\frac{mv}{√(1-v^2/c^2)}=F

Find v(t) and show that v → c as t→∞. Find the distance traveled by the electron
in time t if it starts from rest.


I started by taking the derivative of the momentum with respect to time and obtained:

F=ma/(1-v^2/c^2)^3/2

I'm not sure how to continue from here. This differential equation doesn't look simple to solve but it's actually from the very first set of exercises of an introductory ODE chapter so I don't think I'm actually supposed to be solving it. I think I am probably missing something that makes this really simple to solve and am confusing myself.

Any help would be appreciated.
 
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la6ki said:
I've been trying to work on differential equations using several books and one of the first exercise questions I encountered already has me stuck.

The momentum p of an electron at speed v near the speed c of light increases
according to the formula p=mv/√(1-v^2/c^2), where m is a constant. If an electron is subject to a constant force F, Newton's second law describing its motion is

\frac{dp}{dt}=\frac{d}{dt}\frac{mv}{√(1-v^2/c^2)}=F

Find v(t) and show that v → c as t→∞. Find the distance traveled by the electron
in time t if it starts from rest.


I started by taking the derivative of the momentum with respect to time and obtained:

F=ma/(1-v^2/c^2)^3/2

I'm not sure how to continue from here. This differential equation doesn't look simple to solve but it's actually from the very first set of exercises of an introductory ODE chapter so I don't think I'm actually supposed to be solving it. I think I am probably missing something that makes this really simple to solve and am confusing myself.

Any help would be appreciated.

The derivative looks correct.

To avoid confusion, let's state it more clearly: ##\displaystyle \gamma^3 m \frac{dv}{dt} = F##, where ##\displaystyle \gamma = \frac{1}{\sqrt{1 - \frac{v^2}{c^2}}}## using the usual definitions.

That's a simple separable ODE, and you have to solve it (no way around it). But it's very easy. You can integrate wrt ##v## by a simple trigonometric substitution. Then find the limit as ##t \to \infty##.

(By the way, in one of your intermediate steps in finding ##v(t)##, you will derive an expression relating ##m,v,F## and ##t## that has a very simple form that is actually immediately obvious from the relationship between force and impulse).

To find the distance, what would you do with ##v(t)##?
 
Last edited:
I don't understand why you took "the derivative of the momentum". You are given that
\frac{dp}{dt}= \frac{d}{dt}\frac{mv}{\sqrt{1- \frac{v^2}{c^2}}}= F

Integrating that is trivial:
\frac{mv}{\sqrt{1- \frac{v^2}{c^2}}}= Ft+ C

Now, solve that for v. Of course, then, v= dx/dt.
 
HallsofIvy said:
I don't understand why you took "the derivative of the momentum". You are given that
\frac{dp}{dt}= \frac{d}{dt}\frac{mv}{\sqrt{1- \frac{v^2}{c^2}}}= F

Integrating that is trivial:
\frac{mv}{\sqrt{1- \frac{v^2}{c^2}}}= Ft+ C

Good point.
 
As I suspected, I was definitely making it more complicated for myself :) Thanks for the help guys, I managed to solve it. I'm still not too experienced and sometimes obvious things don't immediately hit me in the face.
 

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