Solving an Elliptic PDE Using the Characteristic Equation: A Beginner's Guide

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around solving an elliptic partial differential equation (PDE) and the implications of its characteristic equation. Participants explore the nature of the variables involved, particularly whether they can be treated as real or complex, and the physical significance of these variables in the context of the PDE.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes that the characteristic equation derived from the elliptic PDE has no real solutions, leading to questions about the nature of the variables x and y.
  • Another participant asserts that while the characteristic equation does not have real roots, this does not imply that x and y lose their physical significance as real variables.
  • A request for elaboration on the implications of the characteristic curves not lying in real space is made, indicating a desire for deeper understanding.
  • A participant describes the method of characteristics as a way to obtain a family of curves along which the solution propagates, suggesting that if these curves lie in the complex plane, real curves do not exist for the propagation of the solution.
  • Further clarification is sought on the specific procedure used in the example of the elliptic equation and its characteristic equation.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the implications of the characteristic equation's lack of real solutions, particularly regarding the physical significance of the variables involved. The discussion remains unresolved as participants explore these concepts without reaching a consensus.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference the general form of elliptic equations and their characteristic equations, noting conditions such as \(b^2 - ac < 0\) that lead to complex roots. There is an acknowledgment of the limitations in understanding how these characteristics relate to real physical interpretations.

Who May Find This Useful

Students and practitioners interested in partial differential equations, particularly those exploring the characteristics method and the implications of complex solutions in mathematical physics.

maverick280857
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Hello

In our math course, we encountered the following elliptic PDE:

<br /> y^{2}u_{xx} + u_{yy} = 0<br />

In order to solve it, we converted it to the characteristic equation,

<br /> y^{2}\left(\frac{dy}{dx}\right)^{2} + 1 = 0<br />

Next, we wrote:

\frac{dy}{dx} = \frac{i}{y}

My question is: the characteristic equation has no solution in \mathbb{R} but we went ahead and mechanically wrote the expression for dy/dx. Does this mean that we should regard x and y as complex variables? If so, how does one reconcile with the fact that some solution to the PDE as u(x,y) = c is a surface in (x,y,u) space? Perhaps this is a trivial question, but I'm just starting to learn PDEs. Does this also mean that we should not ascribe a physical significance to x and y as coordinates in \mathbb{R}^2?

Thanks.
 
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Yes, the fact that it is an elliptic equation tells you that the characteristic equation does not have real roots.
 
Oops yes, of course...I didn't see that.

Also, in such a case, do y and x lose their "physical significance" of being real variables in real space?
 
Mmm..no, it means that the characteristic curve itself doesn't lie in real space.
That's quite a different thing from saying that x and y cannot be regarded as real variables.
 
arildno said:
Mmm..no, it means that the characteristic curve itself doesn't lie in real space.
That's quite a different thing from saying that x and y cannot be regarded as real variables.

Could you please elaborate? And where can I read more about such issues?
 
Well, my memory on characteristics has gone hazy, so it would be helpful if you posted the precise procedure utilized in the particular example.

However, as a general trait, the method of characteristics is a trick whereby we get a family of curves along everyone of which the u-signal propagates in a simple manner (say, by being conserved).

If therefore that family of curves lie in the complex plane, it means that there aren't a set of real curves y(x) along which u propagates. For example, y cannot be solved entirely as a function of x when we constrict ourselves to the real plane.

Please post a few details about the specific procedure.
 
Ok, so the elliptic equation is

au_{xx} + 2bu_{xy} + cu_{yy} = 0

and its characteristic equation is

a\left(\frac{dy}{dx}\right)^{2} -2b\frac{dy}{dx} + c = 0

Here, b^{2}-ac &lt;0 so it has complex roots, and the characteristic curves are:

\zeta(x,y) = c_{1}
\eta(x,y) = c_{2}
 

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